Malcolm Sinclair Earl of Caithness ancestery in question.

[Akins of that Ilk]

According to official records, the father of Malcolm Ian Sinclair,
20th Earl of Caithness, is supposed to be the late Brigadier James
Roderick Sinclair, 19th Earl of Caithness; however new evidence raises
a question of the present Earl's paternity. See:
http://i1038.photobucket.com/albums/a470/the_scotsman1745/Clan%20Chiefs/moleofcaithness.jpg
Certainly the physical resemblence is striking to say the lewast.

[Mr. Reynold]

On Feb 24, 9:49 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
wrote:
> According to official records, the father of Malcolm Ian Sinclair,
> 20th Earl of Caithness, is supposed to be the late Brigadier James
> Roderick Sinclair, 19th Earl of Caithness; however new evidence raises
> a question of the present Earl's paternity. See:http://i1038.photobucket.com/albums/a470/the_scotsman1745/Clan%20Chie...
> Certainly the physical resemblence is striking to say the lewast.

Here is a list of websites that deal with the fakery that Steven Akins
attempted to get away with respecting his deceptive claims to be a
clan chief.

http://www.scots-titles.com/2011/02/15/fake-clan-chief-aitkins-of-that-ilk/comment-page-2/

http://genforum.genealogy.com/akin/messages/1392.html

http://genforum.genealogy.com/akin/messages/1478.html

http://www.thefreelibrary.com/THE+ALABAM-POT%3B+This+American+tried+to+plant+fake+gravestone+in...-a073210615


The whole story is very well documented and is a very sad case.

[Akins of that Ilk]

On Feb 25, 12:13 pm, "Mr. Reynold" <***@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Feb 24, 9:49 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
> > According to official records, the father of Malcolm Ian Sinclair,
> > 20th Earl of Caithness, is supposed to be the late Brigadier James
> > Roderick Sinclair, 19th Earl of Caithness; however new evidence raises
> > a question of the present Earl's paternity. See:http://i1038.photobucket.com/albums/a470/the_scotsman1745/Clan%20Chie...
> > Certainly the physical resemblence is striking to say the lewast.
>
> Here is a list of websites that deal with the fakery that Steven Akins
> attempted to get away with respecting his deceptive claims to be a
> clan chief.
>
> http://www.scots-titles.com/2011/02/15/fake-clan-chief-aitkins-of-tha...
>
> http://genforum.genealogy.com/akin/messages/1392.html
>
> http://genforum.genealogy.com/akin/messages/1478.html
>
> http://www.thefreelibrary.com/THE+ALABAM-POT%3B+This+American+tried+t...
>
> The whole story is very well documented and is a very sad case.

Ever heard of this fellow?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_MacLeod_of_MacLeod Born John Wolrige-
Gordon in 1935, the second-son of Captain Robert Wolrige-Gordon and
his wife, the former Miss Joan Walter. In 1951 John Wolrige-Gordon
changed his name to John MacLeodf of MacLeod to lay claim to the
chiefship of the Clan MacLeod (his maternal grandmother Mrs. Hubert
Walter's maiden-name being Flora Louisa Cecilia MacLeod. John Wolrige-
Gordon's older brother, Robert Wolrige-Gordon, succeeded his father as
Laird of Hallhead and Baron of Esslemont.

[Mr. Reynold]

On Feb 25, 10:58 am, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
wrote:
> On Feb 25, 12:13 pm, "Mr. Reynold" <***@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Feb 24, 9:49 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > wrote:
>
> > > According to official records, the father of Malcolm Ian Sinclair,
> > > 20th Earl of Caithness, is supposed to be the late Brigadier James
> > > Roderick Sinclair, 19th Earl of Caithness; however new evidence raises
> > > a question of the present Earl's paternity. See:http://i1038.photobucket.com/albums/a470/the_scotsman1745/Clan%20Chie...
> > > Certainly the physical resemblence is striking to say the lewast.
>
> > Here is a list of websites that deal with the fakery that Steven Akins
> > attempted to get away with respecting his deceptive claims to be a
> > clan chief.
>
> >http://www.scots-titles.com/2011/02/15/fake-clan-chief-aitkins-of-tha...
>
> >http://genforum.genealogy.com/akin/messages/1392.html
>
> >http://genforum.genealogy.com/akin/messages/1478.html
>
> >http://www.thefreelibrary.com/THE+ALABAM-POT%3B+This+American+tried+t...
>
> > The whole story is very well documented and is a very sad case.
>
> Ever heard of this fellow?
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_MacLeod_of_MacLeodBorn John Wolrige-
> Gordon in 1935, the second-son of Captain Robert Wolrige-Gordon and
> his wife, the former Miss Joan Walter. In 1951 John Wolrige-Gordon
> changed his name to John MacLeodf of MacLeod to lay claim to the
> chiefship of the Clan MacLeod (his maternal grandmother Mrs. Hubert
> Walter's maiden-name being Flora Louisa Cecilia MacLeod. John Wolrige-
> Gordon's older brother, Robert Wolrige-Gordon, succeeded his father as
> Laird of Hallhead and Baron of Esslemont.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Who ever he is has nothing to do with the fraud you have perpetrated
and been caught at.

[Akins of that Ilk]

On Feb 25, 2:30 pm, "Mr. Reynold" <***@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Feb 25, 10:58 am, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Feb 25, 12:13 pm, "Mr. Reynold" <***@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Feb 24, 9:49 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > wrote:
>
> > > > According to official records, the father of Malcolm Ian Sinclair,
> > > > 20th Earl of Caithness, is supposed to be the late Brigadier James
> > > > Roderick Sinclair, 19th Earl of Caithness; however new evidence raises
> > > > a question of the present Earl's paternity. See:http://i1038.photobucket.com/albums/a470/the_scotsman1745/Clan%20Chie...
> > > > Certainly the physical resemblence is striking to say the lewast.
>
> > > Here is a list of websites that deal with the fakery that Steven Akins
> > > attempted to get away with respecting his deceptive claims to be a
> > > clan chief.
>
> > >http://www.scots-titles.com/2011/02/15/fake-clan-chief-aitkins-of-tha...
>
> > >http://genforum.genealogy.com/akin/messages/1392.html
>
> > >http://genforum.genealogy.com/akin/messages/1478.html
>
> > >http://www.thefreelibrary.com/THE+ALABAM-POT%3B+This+American+tried+t...
>
> > > The whole story is very well documented and is a very sad case.
>
> > Ever heard of this fellow?
>
> >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_MacLeod_of_MacLeodBornJohn Wolrige-
> > Gordon in 1935, the second-son of Captain Robert Wolrige-Gordon and
> > his wife, the former Miss Joan Walter. In 1951 John Wolrige-Gordon
> > changed his name to John MacLeodf of MacLeod to lay claim to the
> > chiefship of the Clan MacLeod (his maternal grandmother Mrs. Hubert
> > Walter's maiden-name being Flora Louisa Cecilia MacLeod. John Wolrige-
> > Gordon's older brother, Robert Wolrige-Gordon, succeeded his father as
> > Laird of Hallhead and Baron of Esslemont.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> Who ever he is has nothing to do with the fraud you have perpetrated
> and been caught at.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

What fraud would that be? I call myself by my legally borne name
acknowledged as such by the government of the state and nation that I
am a citizen of. I am the recognized head of my family which is of
Scots ethnicity and as head of that family, I have seen to it that the
customs and traditions, including the use of heraldry belonging to my
family and dating back more than two centuries is carried on, along
with the use of specific tartan setts or patterns (along with the clan
crest badge) worn by members of my clan as identifying symbols of
kinship and as emblems of our ethnicity and the customs and heritage
that are enshrined within it. None of which can in any way be
considered fraudulent, as there is no legal status in any of these
things, They are, as the Lord Lyon pointed out in respect to the
wearing of eagle's feathers. a matter "of custom and convention, and
has no legal basis" - Opinion of the Lord Lyon King of Arms; from the
Clan Convention at The Scottish Parliament; 25 July 2009; afternoon
session.

[Wes]

It isn't your birthname. You changed it to add "of that Ilk". You
ambiguously stepped around the fact that your "government" is that of
the United States where anyone can call themselves anything "legally".
You mention Lord Lyon in a round-about way, misleading the reader into
thinking he somehow validates your claim. He does not. For goodness
sake man, your own wife turned on you. There comes a point of
dimenishing returns. Honestly, just be quiet and perhaps people will
forget about how much you've embarassed yourself and your 'true'
family name.

Most Sincerely Yours,
Milford, Lord Von Wogglebottom of that Ilk.

[Akins of that Ilk]

On Feb 25, 3:37 pm, Wes <***@aol.com> wrote:
> It isn't your birthname. You changed it to add "of that Ilk". You
> ambiguously stepped around the fact that your "government" is that of
> the United States where anyone can call themselves anything "legally".
> You mention Lord Lyon in a round-about way, misleading the reader into
> thinking he somehow validates your claim. He does not. For goodness
> sake man, your own wife turned on you. There comes a point of
> dimenishing returns. Honestly, just be quiet and perhaps people will
> forget about how much you've embarassed yourself and your 'true'
> family name.
>
> Most Sincerely Yours,
> Milford, Lord Von Wogglebottom of that Ilk.

I did indeed legally amend my name to include the designation "of that
Ilk" as was my right to do so; just as John Wolrige-Gordon changed his
surname to that of his maternal grandmother's maiden name - "MacLeod
of MacLeod"; or as Merlin Moncreiffe (son of Sir Iain Moncreiffe of
that Ilk) changed his surname to his mother's maiden name "Hay" so he
could lay claim to the title of Earl of Erroll and Chief of Clan Hay".
I've hardly done anything so drastic as the aforementioned gentlemen
by simply having the designation "of that Ilk" lawfully included as a
part of my legal name. I believe Innes of Learney touched on this when
he wrote:

"...it was established that in Scots law, they [titles] were part of
the name, and had been so held at the insistance of the Crown(!) and
to secure convictions under an English treason law. The English
authoroties "could not have it both ways" and had no right to
disregard peoples' lawful names, or apply other nsmes to people; so
the old Scoto-Celtic titles survive - where their holders are thick-
skinned enough to stand out for their rights. The legal point is also
of some importance to Scots in U.S.A., etc., where "titles" are (it is
understood) not admitted. Here, although the "name" itself enshrines a
very high social "title," it is in law a name (consisting of the words
employed, neither more nor less) and must therefore be registered as
it stands."

[Wes]

You are wearing no clothes, my dear emperor.

[Akins of that Ilk]

On Feb 25, 5:11 pm, Wes <***@aol.com> wrote:
> You are wearing no clothes, my dear emperor.

I suppose by that you mean I am in some way deluding myself. If I am,
then I suppose I am quite normal to do so, as that is what everyone
does about whatever they believe to be true - be it the existance of a
deity, the divine right of kings, nobility, or the value of "precious"
metals - it's all in our minds, isn't it? You want the truth? Here is
the truth: I am a man born like any other man to a family that goes
back for hundreds of generations beyond memory. I have pride in my
heritage and a fondness for the traditions that distinguish my own
particular ethnic group from others. Among the authentic relics of my
family's past is the coat of arms borne by my ancestors that I have
laid claim to as my personal property through the legal venues
available to me. To me that is worth more than any newly designed
armorial bearings authorized by some administrator of heraldry whose
position of authority, or that of the government or the Crown that
established it, exists only in people's minds, like any law or rule,
or dictate - they can only have power if people believe in them, and
then the said power only extends so far - unlike one's genetics or
blood heritage, which can span vast oceans and even outer space - we
are who we are no matter where we travel, no matter where we are born
or where we live, our ethnicity, our genetic heritage is what it is,
irrespective of made up laws or political borders.

[Graham Milne]

On Feb 26, 12:07 am, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
wrote:
> On Feb 25, 5:11 pm, Wes <***@aol.com> wrote:
>
> > You are wearing no clothes, my dear emperor.
>
> I suppose by that you mean I am in some way deluding myself. If I am,
> then I suppose I am quite normal to do so, as that is what everyone
> does about whatever they believe to be true - be it the existance of a
> deity, the divine right of kings, nobility, or the value of "precious"
> metals - it's all in our minds, isn't it? You want the truth? Here is
> the truth: I am a man born like any other man to a family that goes
> back for hundreds of generations beyond memory. I have pride in my
> heritage and a fondness for the traditions that distinguish my own
> particular ethnic group from others. Among the authentic relics of my
> family's past is the coat of arms borne by my ancestors that I have
> laid claim to as my personal property through the legal venues
> available to me. To me that is worth more than any newly designed
> armorial bearings authorized by some administrator of heraldry whose
> position of authority, or that of the government or the Crown that
> established it, exists only in people's minds, like any law or rule,
> or dictate - they can only have power if people believe in them, and
> then the said power only extends so far - unlike one's genetics or
> blood heritage, which can span vast oceans and even outer space - we
> are who we are no matter where we travel, no matter where we are born
> or where we live, our ethnicity, our genetic heritage is what it is,
> irrespective of made up laws or political borders.

Just a thought. I know nothing of this debate but if there is an
Atkins of that Ilk there must be an 'Ilk' somewhere i.e. a place
called Atkins, since 'of that Ilk' means 'of that place [of that
name]'. Where is Atkins?

[Akins of that Ilk]

On Feb 25, 7:37 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
wrote:
> On Feb 26, 12:07 am, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Feb 25, 5:11 pm, Wes <***@aol.com> wrote:
>
> > > You are wearing no clothes, my dear emperor.
>
> > I suppose by that you mean I am in some way deluding myself. If I am,
> > then I suppose I am quite normal to do so, as that is what everyone
> > does about whatever they believe to be true - be it the existance of a
> > deity, the divine right of kings, nobility, or the value of "precious"
> > metals - it's all in our minds, isn't it? You want the truth? Here is
> > the truth: I am a man born like any other man to a family that goes
> > back for hundreds of generations beyond memory. I have pride in my
> > heritage and a fondness for the traditions that distinguish my own
> > particular ethnic group from others. Among the authentic relics of my
> > family's past is the coat of arms borne by my ancestors that I have
> > laid claim to as my personal property through the legal venues
> > available to me. To me that is worth more than any newly designed
> > armorial bearings authorized by some administrator of heraldry whose
> > position of authority, or that of the government or the Crown that
> > established it, exists only in people's minds, like any law or rule,
> > or dictate - they can only have power if people believe in them, and
> > then the said power only extends so far - unlike one's genetics or
> > blood heritage, which can span vast oceans and even outer space - we
> > are who we are no matter where we travel, no matter where we are born
> > or where we live, our ethnicity, our genetic heritage is what it is,
> > irrespective of made up laws or political borders.
>
> Just a thought. I know nothing of this debate but if there is an
> Atkins of that Ilk there must be an 'Ilk' somewhere i.e. a place
> called Atkins, since 'of that Ilk' means 'of that place [of that
> name]'. Where is Atkins?- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

I'm afraid you are confusing my surname which is Akins with that of
Atkins (it's a bit like Moffat compared to Mowat, or Johnson in
relation to Johnston(e) - similar in spelling but unrelated in
origin). The earliest of my name on record was "John of Akyne" a
Scottish merchant who in 1405, brought a case agains Laurence Tuttbury
of Hull, England, who had illegally seized his ship and goods. The
name Akins is ultimately derived from the Old Norse name Haakon, which
in Gaelic is rendered Eachin or Acain, and is given to a place off the
western coast of Scotland on the Isle of Skye called Kyle Akin (Caol
Acain in Gaelic) which was named for King Hakon of Norway who passed
through the region en route to the Battle of Largs where he was
defeated by King Alexander III of Scotland in 1263 AD. The area known
as Kyle Akin is the site of a now ruined castle called Dunakin, held
by the MacKinnons. The area is also the site of the village of
Kyleakin, begun as a planned community in 1811.

On the use of the designation "of that Ilk", Innes of Learney writes:

"Early in the nineteenth century, the Highland chiefs appear to have
resolved to distinguish themselves from the Lowland lairds of that
ilk, by substituting a re-duplication of the patronymic, hence titles
such as "Macgregor of Macgregor." Since a territorial designation was,
as in legal proceedings, also necessary or convenient, others styled
themselves, e.g. "Macdougall of Macdougall and Dunollie".....Whilst a
number of them have latterly preferred to reduplicate the patronymic,
e.g. Macleod of Macleod, yet the ancient practice was for all chiefs
to use the form "of that ilk," which is the more characteristically
Scottish form of title, and Lamont of that Ilk was officially
recognised under the title in 1909. Even where no land estate existed,
chiefs were styled, e.g. Laird of Macleod and Laird of Mackinnon,
meaning high chief of the Macleods and Mackinnons, and of the clan
country....In full description the title "of that ilk" - so
characteristically Scottish - is almost invariably the form used,
whether by Highland or Lowland chiefs until the nineteenth century."

"Whilst the heads of Highland tribes and clans were, briefly, or
simply known at home as "Maclachlan," "Mackintosh." etc., the chiefs
of Lowland families took their surnames from their lands, e.g. "Sir
Andrew de Leslie," or "Lord Leslie," but were subsequently also
designated "of" the same, hence titles such as "Udny of that Ilk," and
"Dundas of that Ilk," whilst cadets were designated, e.g. "Dundas of
Duddingston," or "Udny of Auchterellon." Highland chiefs had also to
be designatedin land charters, and accordinglywere styled, e.g.
"Cameron of Lochiel," "Macleod of Dunvegan," or "Macdougall of
Dunollie." Outside the Highlands, such titles suggested cadetship
rather than chiefship, and the simple patronymics such as "Maclachlan"
or "Macnab" were found insufficent designations when the chief was at
a distance from his own neighbourhood. Therefore, in order to make
their status clear at Court and amongst the Lowland lairds "of that
ilk," - a style which had come to be recognised as an "honorific title
indicating that the man is head of his family." and which "might or
might not imply ownership of land," many Highland chiefs adopted the
same style (MacLachlan of that Ilk" in 1573 is probably the earliest),
were, like "M'Corquodale of that Ilk," so recorded in the Lyon
Register, and were - alike in Crown charters and Acts of Parliament -
referred to as "The Laird of Mackintosh," or "The Laird of
Macfarlane," although no such place existed."

[Graham Milne]

On Feb 26, 5:09 am, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
wrote:
> On Feb 25, 7:37 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Feb 26, 12:07 am, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > wrote:
>
> > > On Feb 25, 5:11 pm, Wes <***@aol.com> wrote:
>
> > > > You are wearing no clothes, my dear emperor.
>
> > > I suppose by that you mean I am in some way deluding myself. If I am,
> > > then I suppose I am quite normal to do so, as that is what everyone
> > > does about whatever they believe to be true - be it the existance of a
> > > deity, the divine right of kings, nobility, or the value of "precious"
> > > metals - it's all in our minds, isn't it? You want the truth? Here is
> > > the truth: I am a man born like any other man to a family that goes
> > > back for hundreds of generations beyond memory. I have pride in my
> > > heritage and a fondness for the traditions that distinguish my own
> > > particular ethnic group from others. Among the authentic relics of my
> > > family's past is the coat of arms borne by my ancestors that I have
> > > laid claim to as my personal property through the legal venues
> > > available to me. To me that is worth more than any newly designed
> > > armorial bearings authorized by some administrator of heraldry whose
> > > position of authority, or that of the government or the Crown that
> > > established it, exists only in people's minds, like any law or rule,
> > > or dictate - they can only have power if people believe in them, and
> > > then the said power only extends so far - unlike one's genetics or
> > > blood heritage, which can span vast oceans and even outer space - we
> > > are who we are no matter where we travel, no matter where we are born
> > > or where we live, our ethnicity, our genetic heritage is what it is,
> > > irrespective of made up laws or political borders.
>
> > Just a thought. I know nothing of this debate but if there is an
> > Atkins of that Ilk there must be an 'Ilk' somewhere i.e. a place
> > called Atkins, since 'of that Ilk' means 'of that place [of that
> > name]'. Where is Atkins?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> I'm afraid you are confusing my surname which is Akins with that of
> Atkins (it's a bit like Moffat compared to Mowat, or Johnson in
> relation to Johnston(e) - similar in spelling but unrelated in
> origin). The earliest of my name on record was "John of Akyne" a
> Scottish merchant who in 1405, brought a case agains Laurence Tuttbury
> of Hull, England, who had illegally seized his ship and goods. The
> name Akins is ultimately derived from the Old Norse name Haakon, which
> in Gaelic is rendered Eachin or Acain, and is given to a place off the
> western coast of Scotland on the Isle of Skye called Kyle Akin (Caol
> Acain in Gaelic) which was named for King Hakon of Norway who passed
> through the region en route to the Battle of Largs where he was
> defeated by King Alexander III of Scotland in 1263 AD. The area known
> as Kyle Akin is the site of a now ruined castle called Dunakin, held
> by the MacKinnons. The area is also the site of the village of
> Kyleakin, begun as a planned community in 1811.
>
> On the use of the designation "of that Ilk", Innes of Learney writes:
>
> "Early in the nineteenth century, the Highland chiefs appear to have
> resolved to distinguish themselves from the Lowland lairds of that
> ilk, by substituting a re-duplication of the patronymic, hence titles
> such as "Macgregor of Macgregor." Since a territorial designation was,
> as in legal proceedings, also necessary or convenient, others styled
> themselves, e.g. "Macdougall of Macdougall and Dunollie".....Whilst a
> number of them have latterly preferred to reduplicate the patronymic,
> e.g. Macleod of Macleod, yet the ancient practice was for all chiefs
> to use the form "of that ilk," which is the more characteristically
> Scottish form of title, and Lamont of that Ilk was officially
> recognised under the title in 1909. Even where no land estate existed,
> chiefs were styled, e.g. Laird of Macleod and Laird of Mackinnon,
> meaning high chief of the Macleods and Mackinnons, and of the clan
> country....In full description the title "of that ilk" - so
> characteristically Scottish - is almost invariably the form used,
> whether by Highland or Lowland chiefs until the nineteenth century."
>
> "Whilst the heads of Highland tribes and clans were, briefly, or
> simply known at home as "Maclachlan," "Mackintosh." etc., the chiefs
> of Lowland families took their surnames from their lands, e.g. "Sir
> Andrew de Leslie," or "Lord Leslie," but were subsequently also
> designated "of" the same, hence titles such as "Udny of that Ilk," and
> "Dundas of that Ilk," whilst cadets were designated, e.g. "Dundas of
> Duddingston," or "Udny of Auchterellon." Highland chiefs had also to
> be designatedin land charters, and accordinglywere styled, e.g.
> "Cameron of Lochiel," "Macleod of Dunvegan," or "Macdougall of
> Dunollie." Outside the Highlands, such titles suggested cadetship
> rather than chiefship, and the simple patronymics such as "Maclachlan"
> or "Macnab" were found insufficent designations when the chief was at
> a distance from his own neighbourhood. Therefore, in order to make
> their status clear at Court and amongst the Lowland lairds "of that
> ilk," - a style which had come to be recognised as an "honorific title
> indicating that the man is head of his family." and which "might or
> might not imply ownership of land," many Highland chiefs adopted the
> same style (MacLachlan of that Ilk" in 1573 is probably the earliest),
> were, like "M'Corquodale of that Ilk," so recorded in the Lyon
> Register, and were - alike in Crown charters and Acts of Parliament -
> referred to as "The Laird of Mackintosh," or "The Laird of
> Macfarlane," although no such place existed."

Is there any evidence that the Akins lived at Kyleakin (I sailed past
there last summer)? If the name comes from Dunakin then they must have
lived there.

According to:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caisteal_Maol

the castle went to the Mackinnons in about 900 through marriage and
seems to have been held by the Norsemen before that, though that
doesn't prevent other families living in the area of course.

[Graham Milne]

On Feb 26, 2:13 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
wrote:

PS At:

http://www.zen98766.zen.co.uk/history/history.htm

it says 'It is sometimes said a clan called Akin or Aiken started out
here. However, in the times that people started using the surname
Akin, the village did not even exist.'

[Akins of that Ilk]

On Feb 26, 8:25 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
wrote:
> On Feb 26, 2:13 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> wrote:
>
> PS At:
>
> http://www.zen98766.zen.co.uk/history/history.htm
>
> it says 'It is sometimes said a clan called Akin or Aiken started out
> here. However, in the times that people started using the surname
> Akin, the village did not even exist.'

Although the village of Kyleakin is relatively modern (begun in 1811),
the area where the village is located - Kyle Akin - was known by that
name centuries earlier, being named after King Hakon IV of Norway who
staged his invasion of Scotland there in 1263 AD. That the area known
as Kyle Akin was inhabited well before the establishment of the early
19th century village called Kyleakin is attested by the existence of
Dunakin Castle, which dates to the Middle Ages.

Writing in Frank Adam‘s The Clans, Septs & Regiments of the Scottish
Highlands, Sir Thomas Innes of Learney states: "...it was established
that in Scots law, they [titles] were part of the name, and had been
so held at the insistance of the Crown(!) and to secure convictions
under an English treason law. The English authorities "could not have
it both ways" and had no right to disregard peoples' lawful names, or
apply other names to people; so the old Scoto-Celtic titles survive -
where their holders are thick-skinned enough to stand out for their
rights. The legal point is also of some importance to Scots in U.S.A.,
etc., where "titles" are (it is understood) not admitted. Here,
although the "name" itself enshrines a very high social "title," it is
in law a name (consisting of the words employed, neither more nor
less) and must therefore be registered as it stands."

“The point was indeed raised by some heirs of Highland chiefs whose
predecessors had been forfeited after “the 15” and the Lord Advocate,
on behalf of the Crown, maintained successfully, that the attainders
were effective because the designations “of Lochiel.” “of Clanranald”
etc., were part of the name:

“Lord Advocate: He was properly enough called, according to the
use of speech, “of Lochiel,” and having been attainted by that name,
if he had got a pardon, must have been pardoned by that name…..People
lose their rights by forfeiture, but not their ordinary names, and
these names do not necessarily imply either the property nor right of
apparency in the estates. Gentlemen are named of their estates and
retain the same titles after they have sold them, which are also given
to their eldest sons.”

[Graham Milne]

On Feb 26, 4:32 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
wrote:

snip

Is there any evidence that the Akins lived at Kyleakin?

[Akins of that Ilk]

On Feb 26, 11:17 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
wrote:
> On Feb 26, 4:32 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
> snip
>
> Is there any evidence that the Akins lived at Kyleakin?

Perhaps a bit of graffitti scratched on one of the rocks of
Dunakin.....there is our DNA http://www.worldfamilies.net/surnames/akins/results
which is catagorized as R1b1b2a1b5, known as the Northwest Irish modal
haplotype or Niall of the Nine Hostages group:

"As expected the majority of the Ulster families are the R1b1b2
haplogroup and its subclades. The group comes in circa 85% at present.
The dominate subclade in the group is the R1b1b2a1b5, which includes
the Northwest Irish modal, the R1b1b2a1b5b, or as some like to call it
the Niall of the Nine Hostages group. Most of the participants
classified into the R1b1b2 group have not yet done the necessary
subclade tests to determine if they also would be R1b1b2a1b5 group and
it is very likely that the majority would test positive to it.These
people are the descendants of Celtic tribal groups indigenous to
northern Ireland, Argyll, Aryshire, Wales, and other locations in
northern Britain." - http://uhblog.ulsterheritage.com/2009/04/ulsters-genetic-roots-revealed.html

[Graham Milne]

On Feb 26, 5:28 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
wrote:
> On Feb 26, 11:17 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> wrote:
>
> > On Feb 26, 4:32 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > wrote:
>
> > snip
>
> > Is there any evidence that the Akins lived at Kyleakin?
>
> Perhaps a bit of graffitti scratched on one of the rocks of
> Dunakin.....there is our DNAhttp://www.worldfamilies.net/surnames/akins/results
> which is catagorized as R1b1b2a1b5, known as the Northwest Irish modal
> haplotype or Niall of the Nine Hostages group:
>
> "As expected the majority of the Ulster families are the R1b1b2
> haplogroup and its subclades. The group comes in circa 85% at present.
> The dominate subclade in the group is the R1b1b2a1b5, which includes
> the Northwest Irish modal, the R1b1b2a1b5b, or as some like to call it
> the Niall of the Nine Hostages group. Most of the participants
> classified into the R1b1b2 group have not yet done the necessary
> subclade tests to determine if they also would be R1b1b2a1b5 group and
> it is very likely that the majority would test positive to it.These
> people are the descendants of Celtic tribal groups indigenous to
> northern Ireland, Argyll, Aryshire, Wales, and other locations in
> northern Britain."  -http://uhblog.ulsterheritage.com/2009/04/ulsters-genetic-roots-reveal...

That doesn't establish a connection to Kyleakin, merely a general
Celtic descent.

[Akins of that Ilk]

On Feb 26, 1:46 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
wrote:
> On Feb 26, 5:28 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Feb 26, 11:17 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > wrote:
>
> > > On Feb 26, 4:32 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > wrote:
>
> > > snip
>
> > > Is there any evidence that the Akins lived at Kyleakin?
>
> > Perhaps a bit of graffitti scratched on one of the rocks of
> > Dunakin.....there is our DNAhttp://www.worldfamilies.net/surnames/akins/results
> > which is catagorized as R1b1b2a1b5, known as the Northwest Irish modal
> > haplotype or Niall of the Nine Hostages group:
>
> > "As expected the majority of the Ulster families are the R1b1b2
> > haplogroup and its subclades. The group comes in circa 85% at present.
> > The dominate subclade in the group is the R1b1b2a1b5, which includes
> > the Northwest Irish modal, the R1b1b2a1b5b, or as some like to call it
> > the Niall of the Nine Hostages group. Most of the participants
> > classified into the R1b1b2 group have not yet done the necessary
> > subclade tests to determine if they also would be R1b1b2a1b5 group and
> > it is very likely that the majority would test positive to it.These
> > people are the descendants of Celtic tribal groups indigenous to
> > northern Ireland, Argyll, Aryshire, Wales, and other locations in
> > northern Britain."  -http://uhblog.ulsterheritage.com/2009/04/ulsters-genetic-roots-reveal...
>
> That doesn't establish a connection to Kyleakin, merely a general
> Celtic descent.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

I believe to get to the connection with the area of Kyle Akin you
would have to go back to the rather apochryphal ancient history of our
clan which states according to oral tradition that we are descended
from Eachin (Acainus), a son of Fingon (Findanus), son of Dungal
(Doungallus), son of Giric (Gregorius), son of Ailpein (Alpinus), son
of Eochaidh, etc....

[Graham Milne]

On Feb 26, 9:34 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
wrote:
> On Feb 26, 1:46 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Feb 26, 5:28 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > wrote:
>
> > > On Feb 26, 11:17 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > wrote:
>
> > > > On Feb 26, 4:32 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > wrote:
>
> > > > snip
>
> > > > Is there any evidence that the Akins lived at Kyleakin?
>
> > > Perhaps a bit of graffitti scratched on one of the rocks of
> > > Dunakin.....there is our DNAhttp://www.worldfamilies.net/surnames/akins/results
> > > which is catagorized as R1b1b2a1b5, known as the Northwest Irish modal
> > > haplotype or Niall of the Nine Hostages group:
>
> > > "As expected the majority of the Ulster families are the R1b1b2
> > > haplogroup and its subclades. The group comes in circa 85% at present.
> > > The dominate subclade in the group is the R1b1b2a1b5, which includes
> > > the Northwest Irish modal, the R1b1b2a1b5b, or as some like to call it
> > > the Niall of the Nine Hostages group. Most of the participants
> > > classified into the R1b1b2 group have not yet done the necessary
> > > subclade tests to determine if they also would be R1b1b2a1b5 group and
> > > it is very likely that the majority would test positive to it.These
> > > people are the descendants of Celtic tribal groups indigenous to
> > > northern Ireland, Argyll, Aryshire, Wales, and other locations in
> > > northern Britain."  -http://uhblog.ulsterheritage.com/2009/04/ulsters-genetic-roots-reveal...
>
> > That doesn't establish a connection to Kyleakin, merely a general
> > Celtic descent.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> I believe to get to the connection with the area of Kyle Akin you
> would have to go back to the rather apochryphal ancient history of our
> clan which states according to oral tradition that we are descended
> from Eachin (Acainus), a son of Fingon (Findanus), son of Dungal
> (Doungallus), son of Giric (Gregorius), son of Ailpein (Alpinus), son
> of Eochaidh, etc....

Can I take it from all this waffle that you have no proof whatsoever
that the Akins family have any connection to Kyleakin?

[Akins of that Ilk]

On Feb 26, 5:26 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
wrote:
> On Feb 26, 9:34 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Feb 26, 1:46 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > wrote:
>
> > > On Feb 26, 5:28 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > wrote:
>
> > > > On Feb 26, 11:17 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > On Feb 26, 4:32 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > snip
>
> > > > > Is there any evidence that the Akins lived at Kyleakin?
>
> > > > Perhaps a bit of graffitti scratched on one of the rocks of
> > > > Dunakin.....there is our DNAhttp://www.worldfamilies.net/surnames/akins/results
> > > > which is catagorized as R1b1b2a1b5, known as the Northwest Irish modal
> > > > haplotype or Niall of the Nine Hostages group:
>
> > > > "As expected the majority of the Ulster families are the R1b1b2
> > > > haplogroup and its subclades. The group comes in circa 85% at present.
> > > > The dominate subclade in the group is the R1b1b2a1b5, which includes
> > > > the Northwest Irish modal, the R1b1b2a1b5b, or as some like to call it
> > > > the Niall of the Nine Hostages group. Most of the participants
> > > > classified into the R1b1b2 group have not yet done the necessary
> > > > subclade tests to determine if they also would be R1b1b2a1b5 group and
> > > > it is very likely that the majority would test positive to it.These
> > > > people are the descendants of Celtic tribal groups indigenous to
> > > > northern Ireland, Argyll, Aryshire, Wales, and other locations in
> > > > northern Britain."  -http://uhblog.ulsterheritage.com/2009/04/ulsters-genetic-roots-reveal...
>
> > > That doesn't establish a connection to Kyleakin, merely a general
> > > Celtic descent.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > I believe to get to the connection with the area of Kyle Akin you
> > would have to go back to the rather apochryphal ancient history of our
> > clan which states according to oral tradition that we are descended
> > from Eachin (Acainus), a son of Fingon (Findanus), son of Dungal
> > (Doungallus), son of Giric (Gregorius), son of Ailpein (Alpinus), son
> > of Eochaidh, etc....
>
> Can I take it from all this waffle that you have no proof whatsoever
> that the Akins family have any connection to Kyleakin?- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Proof is in the eye of the beholder when it comes to anything which
one does not personally experience first hand. At some point we all
have to resign ourselves to the fact that we can never have definate
proof of everything and that we must either accept what we are told is
the truth or reject it. I accept the fact that my clan has pedigree
which traces our origins back to Eachann mac Fingon mac Dungal mac
Gregor mac Alpin mac Eochaidh mac Aedh Find of the line of Fergus mac
Erc. I accept that there are legendary accounts that Dun Akin castle
and Kyle Akin derive their name from Hakon I, son of Harald Fairhair,
through the marriage of Hakon's daughter Maria to Fingon mac Dungal,
who are given as the early ancestors of the Clan Akins going back to
the Dark Ages, which would place my ancestors at Kyle Akin during a
time from which we have very little in the way of surviving records of
indisputable reliability.

[Graham Milne]

On Feb 26, 11:59 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
wrote:
> On Feb 26, 5:26 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Feb 26, 9:34 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > wrote:
>
> > > On Feb 26, 1:46 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > wrote:
>
> > > > On Feb 26, 5:28 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > On Feb 26, 11:17 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > On Feb 26, 4:32 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > snip
>
> > > > > > Is there any evidence that the Akins lived at Kyleakin?
>
> > > > > Perhaps a bit of graffitti scratched on one of the rocks of
> > > > > Dunakin.....there is our DNAhttp://www.worldfamilies.net/surnames/akins/results
> > > > > which is catagorized as R1b1b2a1b5, known as the Northwest Irish modal
> > > > > haplotype or Niall of the Nine Hostages group:
>
> > > > > "As expected the majority of the Ulster families are the R1b1b2
> > > > > haplogroup and its subclades. The group comes in circa 85% at present.
> > > > > The dominate subclade in the group is the R1b1b2a1b5, which includes
> > > > > the Northwest Irish modal, the R1b1b2a1b5b, or as some like to call it
> > > > > the Niall of the Nine Hostages group. Most of the participants
> > > > > classified into the R1b1b2 group have not yet done the necessary
> > > > > subclade tests to determine if they also would be R1b1b2a1b5 group and
> > > > > it is very likely that the majority would test positive to it.These
> > > > > people are the descendants of Celtic tribal groups indigenous to
> > > > > northern Ireland, Argyll, Aryshire, Wales, and other locations in
> > > > > northern Britain."  -http://uhblog.ulsterheritage.com/2009/04/ulsters-genetic-roots-reveal...
>
> > > > That doesn't establish a connection to Kyleakin, merely a general
> > > > Celtic descent.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > > I believe to get to the connection with the area of Kyle Akin you
> > > would have to go back to the rather apochryphal ancient history of our
> > > clan which states according to oral tradition that we are descended
> > > from Eachin (Acainus), a son of Fingon (Findanus), son of Dungal
> > > (Doungallus), son of Giric (Gregorius), son of Ailpein (Alpinus), son
> > > of Eochaidh, etc....
>
> > Can I take it from all this waffle that you have no proof whatsoever
> > that the Akins family have any connection to Kyleakin?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> Proof is in the eye of the beholder when it comes to anything which
> one does not personally experience first hand. At some point we all
> have to resign ourselves to the fact that we can never have definate
> proof of everything and that we must either accept what we are told is
> the truth or reject it. I accept the fact that my clan has pedigree
> which traces our origins back to Eachann mac Fingon mac Dungal mac
> Gregor mac Alpin mac Eochaidh mac Aedh Find of the line of Fergus mac
> Erc. I accept that there are legendary accounts that Dun Akin castle
> and Kyle Akin derive their name from Hakon I, son of Harald Fairhair,
> through the marriage of Hakon's daughter Maria to Fingon mac Dungal,
> who are given as the early ancestors of the Clan Akins going back to
> the Dark Ages, which would place my ancestors at Kyle Akin during a
> time from which we have very little in the way of surviving records of
> indisputable reliability.

You seem to be claiming descent from Hakon. This would make us
cousins. I have 67 documented descents from Olaf II (St. Olaf), who I
think was Hakon's great-great-great-great-grandson (I didn't know of
Hakon's connection to Kyleakin when I sailed there last summer - Wish
I had!). Here's one:

Olaf II, King of Norway = Astrid III
Ordulf, Duke of Saxony = Wulfhilda of Norway
Magnus, Duke of Saxony = Sophia of Hungary
Henry I, Duke of Bavaria = Wulfhilda of Saxony
Frederick II of Einaugige = Judith of Bavaria
Frederick I 'Barbarossa' = Beatrix of Burgundy
Philip II of Swabia = Irene Angelica (great-great-granddaughter of
Alexius I Comnenus, Emperor of Byzantium)
Henry II of Brabant = Marie of Swabia
Robert I of Artois = Mechtilde of Brabant
Edmund 'Crouchback', Earl of Lancaster = Blanche of Artois
Henry, Earl of Lancaster = Maud de Chaworth
Sir Richard FitzAlan, Earl of Arundel = Eleanor Plantagenet
Sir John FitzAlan, Earl of Arundel = Eleanor Maltravers
Sir Thomas Willoughby of Parham = Joan FitzAlan
Sir Robert Willoughby = Cicely Welles
Christopher Willoughby of Parham, Baron Willoughby d'Eresby = Marjery
Jenny
William Eure, 1st Baron Eure = Elizabeth Willoughby
Sir Ralph Eure, Warden of The Middle March = Margery Bowes
Robert Lambton of Lambton (d. 1583) = Frances Eure
John Lambton of Durham (d. 1628) = Katherine Kirby
John Lambton of Durham (b. 1624) = Margaret Hall
Sir Robert Eden (b. 1644 d. 17 May 1720) = Margaret Lambton (b. 1651
d. 22 Jul 1730)
Sir John Eden (b. About 1680 d. 2 May 1728) = Catherine Shafto (d. 2
Jul 1730)
Sir Robert Eden (b. About 1718 d. 25 Jun 1755) = Mary Davison of
Beamish (d. 30 Jan 1794)
Thomas Eden (b. 1734 d. 1 May 1805) = Mariana Jones (b. About 1750)
Arthur Eden (b. 9 Aug 1793 d. 1874) = Frances Buncombe-Poulett-
Thomson (d. 25 Mar 1877)
Hugh Hammersley (d. 28 Sep 1882) = Dulcibella Eden (d. 1903)
Walter Nassau Senior (b. 1850 d. 1933) = Mabel Barbara Hammersley (b.
1864 d. 1943)
Oliver Nassau Senior (b. 1901) = Dorothy Gardner Smith (b. 31 May
1904)
Denys Gordon Milne, CBE (b. 12 Jan 1926) = Pamela Mary Senior (b. 23
Aug 1928)
Graham Nassau Gordon Senior-Milne (b. 29 Sep 1955)

I also have 406 documented descents from Kenneth MacAlpin. Here's one:

Kenneth I MacAlpin, King of Scots = Not known
Constantine I, King of Scots = Not known
Donald II, King of Scots = Not known
Malcolm I, King of Scots = Not known
Kenneth II, King of Scots = Not known
Malcolm II, King of Scots = Not known
Crinan 'The Thane', Mormaer of Atholl = Bethoc
Duncan I, King of Scots = Sybilla
Malcolm III 'Canmore', King of Scots = St. Margaret
Henry I 'Beauclerc', King of England = Matilda of Scotland
Geoffrey V of Anjou = Matilda of Germany
Henry II 'Fitzempress', King of England = Eleanor of Aquitaine,
Duchess of Aquitaine
Alphonso VIII, King of Castile = Eleanor Plantagenet
Louis VIII, King of France = Blanche of Castile
Robert I of Artois = Mechtilde of Brabant
(See above for remainder)

Welcome to the family!

[Graham Milne]

On Feb 27, 11:51 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
wrote:
> On Feb 26, 11:59 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Feb 26, 5:26 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > wrote:
>
> > > On Feb 26, 9:34 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > wrote:
>
> > > > On Feb 26, 1:46 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > On Feb 26, 5:28 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > On Feb 26, 11:17 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > On Feb 26, 4:32 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > snip
>
> > > > > > > Is there any evidence that the Akins lived at Kyleakin?
>
> > > > > > Perhaps a bit of graffitti scratched on one of the rocks of
> > > > > > Dunakin.....there is our DNAhttp://www.worldfamilies.net/surnames/akins/results
> > > > > > which is catagorized as R1b1b2a1b5, known as the Northwest Irish modal
> > > > > > haplotype or Niall of the Nine Hostages group:
>
> > > > > > "As expected the majority of the Ulster families are the R1b1b2
> > > > > > haplogroup and its subclades. The group comes in circa 85% at present.
> > > > > > The dominate subclade in the group is the R1b1b2a1b5, which includes
> > > > > > the Northwest Irish modal, the R1b1b2a1b5b, or as some like to call it
> > > > > > the Niall of the Nine Hostages group. Most of the participants
> > > > > > classified into the R1b1b2 group have not yet done the necessary
> > > > > > subclade tests to determine if they also would be R1b1b2a1b5 group and
> > > > > > it is very likely that the majority would test positive to it.These
> > > > > > people are the descendants of Celtic tribal groups indigenous to
> > > > > > northern Ireland, Argyll, Aryshire, Wales, and other locations in
> > > > > > northern Britain."  -http://uhblog.ulsterheritage.com/2009/04/ulsters-genetic-roots-reveal...
>
> > > > > That doesn't establish a connection to Kyleakin, merely a general
> > > > > Celtic descent.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > > > I believe to get to the connection with the area of Kyle Akin you
> > > > would have to go back to the rather apochryphal ancient history of our
> > > > clan which states according to oral tradition that we are descended
> > > > from Eachin (Acainus), a son of Fingon (Findanus), son of Dungal
> > > > (Doungallus), son of Giric (Gregorius), son of Ailpein (Alpinus), son
> > > > of Eochaidh, etc....
>
> > > Can I take it from all this waffle that you have no proof whatsoever
> > > that the Akins family have any connection to Kyleakin?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > Proof is in the eye of the beholder when it comes to anything which
> > one does not personally experience first hand. At some point we all
> > have to resign ourselves to the fact that we can never have definate
> > proof of everything and that we must either accept what we are told is
> > the truth or reject it. I accept the fact that my clan has pedigree
> > which traces our origins back to Eachann mac Fingon mac Dungal mac
> > Gregor mac Alpin mac Eochaidh mac Aedh Find of the line of Fergus mac
> > Erc. I accept that there are legendary accounts that Dun Akin castle
> > and Kyle Akin derive their name from Hakon I, son of Harald Fairhair,
> > through the marriage of Hakon's daughter Maria to Fingon mac Dungal,
> > who are given as the early ancestors of the Clan Akins going back to
> > the Dark Ages, which would place my ancestors at Kyle Akin during a
> > time from which we have very little in the way of surviving records of
> > indisputable reliability.
>
> You seem to be claiming descent from Hakon. This would make us
> cousins. I have 67 documented descents from Olaf II (St. Olaf), who I
> think was Hakon's great-great-great-great-grandson (I didn't know of
> Hakon's connection to Kyleakin when I sailed there last summer - Wish
> I had!). Here's one:
>
> Olaf II, King of Norway =  Astrid III
> Ordulf, Duke of Saxony =  Wulfhilda of Norway
> Magnus, Duke of Saxony  =  Sophia of Hungary
> Henry I, Duke of Bavaria  =  Wulfhilda of Saxony
> Frederick II of Einaugige  =  Judith of Bavaria
> Frederick I 'Barbarossa'  =  Beatrix of Burgundy
> Philip II of Swabia =  Irene Angelica (great-great-granddaughter of
> Alexius I Comnenus, Emperor of Byzantium)
> Henry II of Brabant =  Marie of Swabia
> Robert I of Artois =  Mechtilde of Brabant
> Edmund 'Crouchback', Earl of Lancaster  =  Blanche of Artois
> Henry, Earl of Lancaster =  Maud de Chaworth
> Sir Richard FitzAlan, Earl of Arundel =  Eleanor Plantagenet
> Sir John FitzAlan, Earl of Arundel =  Eleanor Maltravers
> Sir Thomas Willoughby of Parham =  Joan FitzAlan
> Sir Robert Willoughby =  Cicely Welles
> Christopher Willoughby of Parham, Baron Willoughby d'Eresby =  Marjery
> Jenny
> William Eure, 1st Baron Eure =  Elizabeth Willoughby
> Sir Ralph Eure, Warden of The Middle March =  Margery Bowes
> Robert Lambton of Lambton (d. 1583) =  Frances Eure
> John Lambton of Durham (d. 1628) =  Katherine Kirby
> John Lambton of Durham (b. 1624) =  Margaret Hall
> Sir Robert Eden (b. 1644 d. 17 May 1720) =  Margaret Lambton (b. 1651
> d. 22 Jul 1730)
> Sir John Eden (b. About 1680 d. 2 May 1728) =  Catherine Shafto (d. 2
> Jul 1730)
> Sir Robert Eden (b. About 1718 d. 25 Jun 1755) =  Mary Davison of
> Beamish (d. 30 Jan 1794)
> Thomas Eden (b. 1734 d. 1 May 1805) =  Mariana Jones (b. About 1750)
> Arthur Eden (b. 9 Aug 1793 d. 1874) =  Frances Buncombe-Poulett-
> Thomson (d. 25 Mar 1877)
> Hugh Hammersley (d. 28 Sep 1882) =  Dulcibella Eden (d. 1903)
> Walter Nassau Senior (b. 1850 d. 1933) =  Mabel Barbara Hammersley (b.
> 1864 d. 1943)
> Oliver Nassau Senior (b. 1901) =  Dorothy Gardner Smith (b. 31 May
> 1904)
> Denys Gordon Milne, CBE (b. 12 Jan 1926) =  Pamela Mary Senior (b. 23
> Aug 1928)
> Graham Nassau Gordon Senior-Milne (b. 29 Sep 1955)
>
> I also have 406 documented descents from Kenneth MacAlpin. Here's one:
>
> Kenneth I MacAlpin, King of Scots =  Not known
> Constantine I, King of Scots =  Not known
> Donald II, King of Scots =  Not known
> Malcolm I, King of Scots =  Not known
> Kenneth II, King of Scots =  Not known
> Malcolm II, King of Scots =  Not known
> Crinan 'The Thane', Mormaer of Atholl =  Bethoc
> Duncan I, King of Scots =  Sybilla
> Malcolm III 'Canmore', King of Scots =  St. Margaret
> Henry I 'Beauclerc', King of England =  Matilda of Scotland
> Geoffrey V of Anjou =  Matilda of Germany
> Henry II 'Fitzempress', King of England =  Eleanor of Aquitaine,
> Duchess of Aquitaine
> Alphonso VIII, King of Castile =  Eleanor Plantagenet
> Louis VIII, King of France =  Blanche of Castile
> Robert I of Artois =  Mechtilde of Brabant
> (See above for remainder)
>
> Welcome to the family!

PS I think you will find these lines amongst quite a number of this
groups members.

[Akins of that Ilk]

On Feb 27, 6:16 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
wrote:
> On Feb 27, 11:51 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Feb 26, 11:59 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > wrote:
>
> > > On Feb 26, 5:26 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > wrote:
>
> > > > On Feb 26, 9:34 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > On Feb 26, 1:46 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > On Feb 26, 5:28 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > On Feb 26, 11:17 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > On Feb 26, 4:32 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > snip
>
> > > > > > > > Is there any evidence that the Akins lived at Kyleakin?
>
> > > > > > > Perhaps a bit of graffitti scratched on one of the rocks of
> > > > > > > Dunakin.....there is our DNAhttp://www.worldfamilies.net/surnames/akins/results
> > > > > > > which is catagorized as R1b1b2a1b5, known as the Northwest Irish modal
> > > > > > > haplotype or Niall of the Nine Hostages group:
>
> > > > > > > "As expected the majority of the Ulster families are the R1b1b2
> > > > > > > haplogroup and its subclades. The group comes in circa 85% at present.
> > > > > > > The dominate subclade in the group is the R1b1b2a1b5, which includes
> > > > > > > the Northwest Irish modal, the R1b1b2a1b5b, or as some like to call it
> > > > > > > the Niall of the Nine Hostages group. Most of the participants
> > > > > > > classified into the R1b1b2 group have not yet done the necessary
> > > > > > > subclade tests to determine if they also would be R1b1b2a1b5 group and
> > > > > > > it is very likely that the majority would test positive to it.These
> > > > > > > people are the descendants of Celtic tribal groups indigenous to
> > > > > > > northern Ireland, Argyll, Aryshire, Wales, and other locations in
> > > > > > > northern Britain."  -http://uhblog.ulsterheritage.com/2009/04/ulsters-genetic-roots-reveal...
>
> > > > > > That doesn't establish a connection to Kyleakin, merely a general
> > > > > > Celtic descent.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > > > > I believe to get to the connection with the area of Kyle Akin you
> > > > > would have to go back to the rather apochryphal ancient history of our
> > > > > clan which states according to oral tradition that we are descended
> > > > > from Eachin (Acainus), a son of Fingon (Findanus), son of Dungal
> > > > > (Doungallus), son of Giric (Gregorius), son of Ailpein (Alpinus), son
> > > > > of Eochaidh, etc....
>
> > > > Can I take it from all this waffle that you have no proof whatsoever
> > > > that the Akins family have any connection to Kyleakin?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > > Proof is in the eye of the beholder when it comes to anything which
> > > one does not personally experience first hand. At some point we all
> > > have to resign ourselves to the fact that we can never have definate
> > > proof of everything and that we must either accept what we are told is
> > > the truth or reject it. I accept the fact that my clan has pedigree
> > > which traces our origins back to Eachann mac Fingon mac Dungal mac
> > > Gregor mac Alpin mac Eochaidh mac Aedh Find of the line of Fergus mac
> > > Erc. I accept that there are legendary accounts that Dun Akin castle
> > > and Kyle Akin derive their name from Hakon I, son of Harald Fairhair,
> > > through the marriage of Hakon's daughter Maria to Fingon mac Dungal,
> > > who are given as the early ancestors of the Clan Akins going back to
> > > the Dark Ages, which would place my ancestors at Kyle Akin during a
> > > time from which we have very little in the way of surviving records of
> > > indisputable reliability.
>
> > You seem to be claiming descent from Hakon. This would make us
> > cousins. I have 67 documented descents from Olaf II (St. Olaf), who I
> > think was Hakon's great-great-great-great-grandson (I didn't know of
> > Hakon's connection to Kyleakin when I sailed there last summer - Wish
> > I had!). Here's one:
>
> > Olaf II, King of Norway =  Astrid III
> > Ordulf, Duke of Saxony =  Wulfhilda of Norway
> > Magnus, Duke of Saxony  =  Sophia of Hungary
> > Henry I, Duke of Bavaria  =  Wulfhilda of Saxony
> > Frederick II of Einaugige  =  Judith of Bavaria
> > Frederick I 'Barbarossa'  =  Beatrix of Burgundy
> > Philip II of Swabia =  Irene Angelica (great-great-granddaughter of
> > Alexius I Comnenus, Emperor of Byzantium)
> > Henry II of Brabant =  Marie of Swabia
> > Robert I of Artois =  Mechtilde of Brabant
> > Edmund 'Crouchback', Earl of Lancaster  =  Blanche of Artois
> > Henry, Earl of Lancaster =  Maud de Chaworth
> > Sir Richard FitzAlan, Earl of Arundel =  Eleanor Plantagenet
> > Sir John FitzAlan, Earl of Arundel =  Eleanor Maltravers
> > Sir Thomas Willoughby of Parham =  Joan FitzAlan
> > Sir Robert Willoughby =  Cicely Welles
> > Christopher Willoughby of Parham, Baron Willoughby d'Eresby =  Marjery
> > Jenny
> > William Eure, 1st Baron Eure =  Elizabeth Willoughby
> > Sir Ralph Eure, Warden of The Middle March =  Margery Bowes
> > Robert Lambton of Lambton (d. 1583) =  Frances Eure
> > John Lambton of Durham (d. 1628) =  Katherine Kirby
> > John Lambton of Durham (b. 1624) =  Margaret Hall
> > Sir Robert Eden (b. 1644 d. 17 May 1720) =  Margaret Lambton (b. 1651
> > d. 22 Jul 1730)
> > Sir John Eden (b. About 1680 d. 2 May 1728) =  Catherine Shafto (d. 2
> > Jul 1730)
> > Sir Robert Eden (b. About 1718 d. 25 Jun 1755) =  Mary Davison of
> > Beamish (d. 30 Jan 1794)
> > Thomas Eden (b. 1734 d. 1 May 1805) =  Mariana Jones (b. About 1750)
> > Arthur Eden (b. 9 Aug 1793 d. 1874) =  Frances Buncombe-Poulett-
> > Thomson (d. 25 Mar 1877)
> > Hugh Hammersley (d. 28 Sep 1882) =  Dulcibella Eden (d. 1903)
> > Walter Nassau Senior (b. 1850 d. 1933) =  Mabel Barbara Hammersley (b.
> > 1864 d. 1943)
> > Oliver Nassau Senior (b. 1901) =  Dorothy Gardner Smith (b. 31 May
> > 1904)
> > Denys Gordon Milne, CBE (b. 12 Jan 1926) =  Pamela Mary Senior (b. 23
> > Aug 1928)
> > Graham Nassau Gordon Senior-Milne (b. 29 Sep 1955)
>
> > I also have 406 documented descents from Kenneth MacAlpin. Here's one:
>
> > Kenneth I MacAlpin, King of Scots =  Not known
> > Constantine I, King of Scots =  Not known
> > Donald II, King of Scots =  Not known
> > Malcolm I, King of Scots =  Not known
> > Kenneth II, King of Scots =  Not known
> > Malcolm II, King of Scots =  Not known
> > Crinan 'The Thane', Mormaer of Atholl =  Bethoc
> > Duncan I, King of Scots =  Sybilla
> > Malcolm III 'Canmore', King of Scots =  St. Margaret
> > Henry I 'Beauclerc', King of England =  Matilda of Scotland
> > Geoffrey V of Anjou =  Matilda of Germany
> > Henry II 'Fitzempress', King of England =  Eleanor of Aquitaine,
> > Duchess of Aquitaine
> > Alphonso VIII, King of Castile =  Eleanor Plantagenet
> > Louis VIII, King of France =  Blanche of Castile
> > Robert I of Artois =  Mechtilde of Brabant
> > (See above for remainder)
>
> > Welcome to the family!
>
> PS I think you will find these lines amongst quite a number of this
> groups members.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Undoubtedly so, I have found that several of my families share common
ancestors through one line or another. Among the families who came to
America as colonists in the 1600's and 1700's that I am descended from
are the following:

Akins
Alexander
Anderson
Atkins
Ball
Barnett
Beckham
Black
Broadnax
Butler
Cole
Courington
Davis
Edwards
Evans
Ferebee
Ferris
Forbes
Forrester
Foster
Furlow
Giles
Goad
Goode
Hagan
Harding
Harris
Haynie
Henderson
Henson
Hollis
Howard
Howell
Howle
Hurley
Jones
Joslin
Keeton
Kemp
Kincheloe
Knowles
Lane
Lang
Lewis
Long
Loving
Lucy
Mackerness
McCorkle
McKennie
Mercer
Minter
Morgan
Morris
Mosby
Mote
Parsons
Phillips
Putman
Quatermas
Randolph
Rice
Rutledge
Scott
Smith
Spears
Stacks
Staggs
Stephens
Stribling
Sumner
Taliaferro
Taylor
Thomas
Townley
Traylor
Walker
Watson
Williams
Woodson
Woodward

[Akins of that Ilk]

On Feb 27, 6:16 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
wrote:
> On Feb 27, 11:51 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Feb 26, 11:59 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > wrote:
>
> > > On Feb 26, 5:26 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > wrote:
>
> > > > On Feb 26, 9:34 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > On Feb 26, 1:46 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > On Feb 26, 5:28 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > On Feb 26, 11:17 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > On Feb 26, 4:32 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > snip
>
> > > > > > > > Is there any evidence that the Akins lived at Kyleakin?
>
> > > > > > > Perhaps a bit of graffitti scratched on one of the rocks of
> > > > > > > Dunakin.....there is our DNAhttp://www.worldfamilies.net/surnames/akins/results
> > > > > > > which is catagorized as R1b1b2a1b5, known as the Northwest Irish modal
> > > > > > > haplotype or Niall of the Nine Hostages group:
>
> > > > > > > "As expected the majority of the Ulster families are the R1b1b2
> > > > > > > haplogroup and its subclades. The group comes in circa 85% at present.
> > > > > > > The dominate subclade in the group is the R1b1b2a1b5, which includes
> > > > > > > the Northwest Irish modal, the R1b1b2a1b5b, or as some like to call it
> > > > > > > the Niall of the Nine Hostages group. Most of the participants
> > > > > > > classified into the R1b1b2 group have not yet done the necessary
> > > > > > > subclade tests to determine if they also would be R1b1b2a1b5 group and
> > > > > > > it is very likely that the majority would test positive to it.These
> > > > > > > people are the descendants of Celtic tribal groups indigenous to
> > > > > > > northern Ireland, Argyll, Aryshire, Wales, and other locations in
> > > > > > > northern Britain."  -http://uhblog.ulsterheritage.com/2009/04/ulsters-genetic-roots-reveal...
>
> > > > > > That doesn't establish a connection to Kyleakin, merely a general
> > > > > > Celtic descent.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > > > > I believe to get to the connection with the area of Kyle Akin you
> > > > > would have to go back to the rather apochryphal ancient history of our
> > > > > clan which states according to oral tradition that we are descended
> > > > > from Eachin (Acainus), a son of Fingon (Findanus), son of Dungal
> > > > > (Doungallus), son of Giric (Gregorius), son of Ailpein (Alpinus), son
> > > > > of Eochaidh, etc....
>
> > > > Can I take it from all this waffle that you have no proof whatsoever
> > > > that the Akins family have any connection to Kyleakin?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > > Proof is in the eye of the beholder when it comes to anything which
> > > one does not personally experience first hand. At some point we all
> > > have to resign ourselves to the fact that we can never have definate
> > > proof of everything and that we must either accept what we are told is
> > > the truth or reject it. I accept the fact that my clan has pedigree
> > > which traces our origins back to Eachann mac Fingon mac Dungal mac
> > > Gregor mac Alpin mac Eochaidh mac Aedh Find of the line of Fergus mac
> > > Erc. I accept that there are legendary accounts that Dun Akin castle
> > > and Kyle Akin derive their name from Hakon I, son of Harald Fairhair,
> > > through the marriage of Hakon's daughter Maria to Fingon mac Dungal,
> > > who are given as the early ancestors of the Clan Akins going back to
> > > the Dark Ages, which would place my ancestors at Kyle Akin during a
> > > time from which we have very little in the way of surviving records of
> > > indisputable reliability.
>
> > You seem to be claiming descent from Hakon. This would make us
> > cousins. I have 67 documented descents from Olaf II (St. Olaf), who I
> > think was Hakon's great-great-great-great-grandson (I didn't know of
> > Hakon's connection to Kyleakin when I sailed there last summer - Wish
> > I had!). Here's one:
>
> > Olaf II, King of Norway =  Astrid III
> > Ordulf, Duke of Saxony =  Wulfhilda of Norway
> > Magnus, Duke of Saxony  =  Sophia of Hungary
> > Henry I, Duke of Bavaria  =  Wulfhilda of Saxony
> > Frederick II of Einaugige  =  Judith of Bavaria
> > Frederick I 'Barbarossa'  =  Beatrix of Burgundy
> > Philip II of Swabia =  Irene Angelica (great-great-granddaughter of
> > Alexius I Comnenus, Emperor of Byzantium)
> > Henry II of Brabant =  Marie of Swabia
> > Robert I of Artois =  Mechtilde of Brabant
> > Edmund 'Crouchback', Earl of Lancaster  =  Blanche of Artois
> > Henry, Earl of Lancaster =  Maud de Chaworth
> > Sir Richard FitzAlan, Earl of Arundel =  Eleanor Plantagenet
> > Sir John FitzAlan, Earl of Arundel =  Eleanor Maltravers
> > Sir Thomas Willoughby of Parham =  Joan FitzAlan
> > Sir Robert Willoughby =  Cicely Welles
> > Christopher Willoughby of Parham, Baron Willoughby d'Eresby =  Marjery
> > Jenny
> > William Eure, 1st Baron Eure =  Elizabeth Willoughby
> > Sir Ralph Eure, Warden of The Middle March =  Margery Bowes
> > Robert Lambton of Lambton (d. 1583) =  Frances Eure
> > John Lambton of Durham (d. 1628) =  Katherine Kirby
> > John Lambton of Durham (b. 1624) =  Margaret Hall
> > Sir Robert Eden (b. 1644 d. 17 May 1720) =  Margaret Lambton (b. 1651
> > d. 22 Jul 1730)
> > Sir John Eden (b. About 1680 d. 2 May 1728) =  Catherine Shafto (d. 2
> > Jul 1730)
> > Sir Robert Eden (b. About 1718 d. 25 Jun 1755) =  Mary Davison of
> > Beamish (d. 30 Jan 1794)
> > Thomas Eden (b. 1734 d. 1 May 1805) =  Mariana Jones (b. About 1750)
> > Arthur Eden (b. 9 Aug 1793 d. 1874) =  Frances Buncombe-Poulett-
> > Thomson (d. 25 Mar 1877)
> > Hugh Hammersley (d. 28 Sep 1882) =  Dulcibella Eden (d. 1903)
> > Walter Nassau Senior (b. 1850 d. 1933) =  Mabel Barbara Hammersley (b.
> > 1864 d. 1943)
> > Oliver Nassau Senior (b. 1901) =  Dorothy Gardner Smith (b. 31 May
> > 1904)
> > Denys Gordon Milne, CBE (b. 12 Jan 1926) =  Pamela Mary Senior (b. 23
> > Aug 1928)
> > Graham Nassau Gordon Senior-Milne (b. 29 Sep 1955)
>
> > I also have 406 documented descents from Kenneth MacAlpin. Here's one:
>
> > Kenneth I MacAlpin, King of Scots =  Not known
> > Constantine I, King of Scots =  Not known
> > Donald II, King of Scots =  Not known
> > Malcolm I, King of Scots =  Not known
> > Kenneth II, King of Scots =  Not known
> > Malcolm II, King of Scots =  Not known
> > Crinan 'The Thane', Mormaer of Atholl =  Bethoc
> > Duncan I, King of Scots =  Sybilla
> > Malcolm III 'Canmore', King of Scots =  St. Margaret
> > Henry I 'Beauclerc', King of England =  Matilda of Scotland
> > Geoffrey V of Anjou =  Matilda of Germany
> > Henry II 'Fitzempress', King of England =  Eleanor of Aquitaine,
> > Duchess of Aquitaine
> > Alphonso VIII, King of Castile =  Eleanor Plantagenet
> > Louis VIII, King of France =  Blanche of Castile
> > Robert I of Artois =  Mechtilde of Brabant
> > (See above for remainder)
>
> > Welcome to the family!
>
> PS I think you will find these lines amongst quite a number of this
> groups members.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Undoubtedly so, I have found that several of my families share common
ancestors through one line or another. Among the families who came to
America as colonists in the 1600's and 1700's that I am descended
from
are the following:

Akins
Alexander
Anderson
Atkins
Ball
Barnett
Beckham
Black
Broadnax
Butler
Cole
Courington
Davis
Edwards
Evans
Ferebee
Ferris
Forbes
Forrester
Foster
Furlow
Giles
Goad
Goode
Hagan
Harding
Harris
Haynie
Henderson
Henson
Hollis
Howard
Howell
Howle
Hurley
Jones
Joslin
Keeton
Kemp
Kennemore
Kincheloe
Knowles
Lane
Lang
Lesley
Lewis
Long
Loving
Lucy
Mackerness
McCorkle
McKennie
Mercer
Minter
Morgan
Morris
Mosby
Mote
Parsons
Phillips
Putman
Quatermas
Randolph
Rice
Rutledge
Scott
Smith
Spears
Stacks
Staggs
Stephens
Stribling
Sumner
Taliaferro
Taylor
Thomas
Townley
Traylor
Walker
Watson
Williams
Woodson
Woodward

[Graham Milne]

On Feb 27, 11:51 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
wrote:
> On Feb 26, 11:59 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Feb 26, 5:26 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > wrote:
>
> > > On Feb 26, 9:34 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > wrote:
>
> > > > On Feb 26, 1:46 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > On Feb 26, 5:28 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > On Feb 26, 11:17 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > On Feb 26, 4:32 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > snip
>
> > > > > > > Is there any evidence that the Akins lived at Kyleakin?
>
> > > > > > Perhaps a bit of graffitti scratched on one of the rocks of
> > > > > > Dunakin.....there is our DNAhttp://www.worldfamilies.net/surnames/akins/results
> > > > > > which is catagorized as R1b1b2a1b5, known as the Northwest Irish modal
> > > > > > haplotype or Niall of the Nine Hostages group:
>
> > > > > > "As expected the majority of the Ulster families are the R1b1b2
> > > > > > haplogroup and its subclades. The group comes in circa 85% at present.
> > > > > > The dominate subclade in the group is the R1b1b2a1b5, which includes
> > > > > > the Northwest Irish modal, the R1b1b2a1b5b, or as some like to call it
> > > > > > the Niall of the Nine Hostages group. Most of the participants
> > > > > > classified into the R1b1b2 group have not yet done the necessary
> > > > > > subclade tests to determine if they also would be R1b1b2a1b5 group and
> > > > > > it is very likely that the majority would test positive to it.These
> > > > > > people are the descendants of Celtic tribal groups indigenous to
> > > > > > northern Ireland, Argyll, Aryshire, Wales, and other locations in
> > > > > > northern Britain."  -http://uhblog.ulsterheritage.com/2009/04/ulsters-genetic-roots-reveal...
>
> > > > > That doesn't establish a connection to Kyleakin, merely a general
> > > > > Celtic descent.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > > > I believe to get to the connection with the area of Kyle Akin you
> > > > would have to go back to the rather apochryphal ancient history of our
> > > > clan which states according to oral tradition that we are descended
> > > > from Eachin (Acainus), a son of Fingon (Findanus), son of Dungal
> > > > (Doungallus), son of Giric (Gregorius), son of Ailpein (Alpinus), son
> > > > of Eochaidh, etc....
>
> > > Can I take it from all this waffle that you have no proof whatsoever
> > > that the Akins family have any connection to Kyleakin?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > Proof is in the eye of the beholder when it comes to anything which
> > one does not personally experience first hand. At some point we all
> > have to resign ourselves to the fact that we can never have definate
> > proof of everything and that we must either accept what we are told is
> > the truth or reject it. I accept the fact that my clan has pedigree
> > which traces our origins back to Eachann mac Fingon mac Dungal mac
> > Gregor mac Alpin mac Eochaidh mac Aedh Find of the line of Fergus mac
> > Erc. I accept that there are legendary accounts that Dun Akin castle
> > and Kyle Akin derive their name from Hakon I, son of Harald Fairhair,
> > through the marriage of Hakon's daughter Maria to Fingon mac Dungal,
> > who are given as the early ancestors of the Clan Akins going back to
> > the Dark Ages, which would place my ancestors at Kyle Akin during a
> > time from which we have very little in the way of surviving records of
> > indisputable reliability.
>
> You seem to be claiming descent from Hakon. This would make us
> cousins. I have 67 documented descents from Olaf II (St. Olaf), who I
> think was Hakon's great-great-great-great-grandson (I didn't know of
> Hakon's connection to Kyleakin when I sailed there last summer - Wish
> I had!). Here's one:
>
> Olaf II, King of Norway =  Astrid III
> Ordulf, Duke of Saxony =  Wulfhilda of Norway
> Magnus, Duke of Saxony  =  Sophia of Hungary
> Henry I, Duke of Bavaria  =  Wulfhilda of Saxony
> Frederick II of Einaugige  =  Judith of Bavaria
> Frederick I 'Barbarossa'  =  Beatrix of Burgundy
> Philip II of Swabia =  Irene Angelica (great-great-granddaughter of
> Alexius I Comnenus, Emperor of Byzantium)
> Henry II of Brabant =  Marie of Swabia
> Robert I of Artois =  Mechtilde of Brabant
> Edmund 'Crouchback', Earl of Lancaster  =  Blanche of Artois
> Henry, Earl of Lancaster =  Maud de Chaworth
> Sir Richard FitzAlan, Earl of Arundel =  Eleanor Plantagenet
> Sir John FitzAlan, Earl of Arundel =  Eleanor Maltravers
> Sir Thomas Willoughby of Parham =  Joan FitzAlan
> Sir Robert Willoughby =  Cicely Welles
> Christopher Willoughby of Parham, Baron Willoughby d'Eresby =  Marjery
> Jenny
> William Eure, 1st Baron Eure =  Elizabeth Willoughby
> Sir Ralph Eure, Warden of The Middle March =  Margery Bowes
> Robert Lambton of Lambton (d. 1583) =  Frances Eure
> John Lambton of Durham (d. 1628) =  Katherine Kirby
> John Lambton of Durham (b. 1624) =  Margaret Hall
> Sir Robert Eden (b. 1644 d. 17 May 1720) =  Margaret Lambton (b. 1651
> d. 22 Jul 1730)
> Sir John Eden (b. About 1680 d. 2 May 1728) =  Catherine Shafto (d. 2
> Jul 1730)
> Sir Robert Eden (b. About 1718 d. 25 Jun 1755) =  Mary Davison of
> Beamish (d. 30 Jan 1794)
> Thomas Eden (b. 1734 d. 1 May 1805) =  Mariana Jones (b. About 1750)
> Arthur Eden (b. 9 Aug 1793 d. 1874) =  Frances Buncombe-Poulett-
> Thomson (d. 25 Mar 1877)
> Hugh Hammersley (d. 28 Sep 1882) =  Dulcibella Eden (d. 1903)
> Walter Nassau Senior (b. 1850 d. 1933) =  Mabel Barbara Hammersley (b.
> 1864 d. 1943)
> Oliver Nassau Senior (b. 1901) =  Dorothy Gardner Smith (b. 31 May
> 1904)
> Denys Gordon Milne, CBE (b. 12 Jan 1926) =  Pamela Mary Senior (b. 23
> Aug 1928)
> Graham Nassau Gordon Senior-Milne (b. 29 Sep 1955)
>
> I also have 406 documented descents from Kenneth MacAlpin. Here's one:
>
> Kenneth I MacAlpin, King of Scots =  Not known
> Constantine I, King of Scots =  Not known
> Donald II, King of Scots =  Not known
> Malcolm I, King of Scots =  Not known
> Kenneth II, King of Scots =  Not known
> Malcolm II, King of Scots =  Not known
> Crinan 'The Thane', Mormaer of Atholl =  Bethoc
> Duncan I, King of Scots =  Sybilla
> Malcolm III 'Canmore', King of Scots =  St. Margaret
> Henry I 'Beauclerc', King of England =  Matilda of Scotland
> Geoffrey V of Anjou =  Matilda of Germany
> Henry II 'Fitzempress', King of England =  Eleanor of Aquitaine,
> Duchess of Aquitaine
> Alphonso VIII, King of Castile =  Eleanor Plantagenet
> Louis VIII, King of France =  Blanche of Castile
> Robert I of Artois =  Mechtilde of Brabant
> (See above for remainder)
>
> Welcome to the family!

Here's a pic taken from my uncle's yacht as we sailed past Kyeakin
last year. You can see the castle in the background.

http://www.peerage.org/P1008237.jpg

[Akins of that Ilk]

On Feb 27, 6:27 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
wrote:
> On Feb 27, 11:51 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Feb 26, 11:59 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > wrote:
>
> > > On Feb 26, 5:26 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > wrote:
>
> > > > On Feb 26, 9:34 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > On Feb 26, 1:46 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > On Feb 26, 5:28 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > On Feb 26, 11:17 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > On Feb 26, 4:32 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > snip
>
> > > > > > > > Is there any evidence that the Akins lived at Kyleakin?
>
> > > > > > > Perhaps a bit of graffitti scratched on one of the rocks of
> > > > > > > Dunakin.....there is our DNAhttp://www.worldfamilies.net/surnames/akins/results
> > > > > > > which is catagorized as R1b1b2a1b5, known as the Northwest Irish modal
> > > > > > > haplotype or Niall of the Nine Hostages group:
>
> > > > > > > "As expected the majority of the Ulster families are the R1b1b2
> > > > > > > haplogroup and its subclades. The group comes in circa 85% at present.
> > > > > > > The dominate subclade in the group is the R1b1b2a1b5, which includes
> > > > > > > the Northwest Irish modal, the R1b1b2a1b5b, or as some like to call it
> > > > > > > the Niall of the Nine Hostages group. Most of the participants
> > > > > > > classified into the R1b1b2 group have not yet done the necessary
> > > > > > > subclade tests to determine if they also would be R1b1b2a1b5 group and
> > > > > > > it is very likely that the majority would test positive to it.These
> > > > > > > people are the descendants of Celtic tribal groups indigenous to
> > > > > > > northern Ireland, Argyll, Aryshire, Wales, and other locations in
> > > > > > > northern Britain."  -http://uhblog.ulsterheritage.com/2009/04/ulsters-genetic-roots-reveal...
>
> > > > > > That doesn't establish a connection to Kyleakin, merely a general
> > > > > > Celtic descent.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > > > > I believe to get to the connection with the area of Kyle Akin you
> > > > > would have to go back to the rather apochryphal ancient history of our
> > > > > clan which states according to oral tradition that we are descended
> > > > > from Eachin (Acainus), a son of Fingon (Findanus), son of Dungal
> > > > > (Doungallus), son of Giric (Gregorius), son of Ailpein (Alpinus), son
> > > > > of Eochaidh, etc....
>
> > > > Can I take it from all this waffle that you have no proof whatsoever
> > > > that the Akins family have any connection to Kyleakin?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > > Proof is in the eye of the beholder when it comes to anything which
> > > one does not personally experience first hand. At some point we all
> > > have to resign ourselves to the fact that we can never have definate
> > > proof of everything and that we must either accept what we are told is
> > > the truth or reject it. I accept the fact that my clan has pedigree
> > > which traces our origins back to Eachann mac Fingon mac Dungal mac
> > > Gregor mac Alpin mac Eochaidh mac Aedh Find of the line of Fergus mac
> > > Erc. I accept that there are legendary accounts that Dun Akin castle
> > > and Kyle Akin derive their name from Hakon I, son of Harald Fairhair,
> > > through the marriage of Hakon's daughter Maria to Fingon mac Dungal,
> > > who are given as the early ancestors of the Clan Akins going back to
> > > the Dark Ages, which would place my ancestors at Kyle Akin during a
> > > time from which we have very little in the way of surviving records of
> > > indisputable reliability.
>
> > You seem to be claiming descent from Hakon. This would make us
> > cousins. I have 67 documented descents from Olaf II (St. Olaf), who I
> > think was Hakon's great-great-great-great-grandson (I didn't know of
> > Hakon's connection to Kyleakin when I sailed there last summer - Wish
> > I had!). Here's one:
>
> > Olaf II, King of Norway =  Astrid III
> > Ordulf, Duke of Saxony =  Wulfhilda of Norway
> > Magnus, Duke of Saxony  =  Sophia of Hungary
> > Henry I, Duke of Bavaria  =  Wulfhilda of Saxony
> > Frederick II of Einaugige  =  Judith of Bavaria
> > Frederick I 'Barbarossa'  =  Beatrix of Burgundy
> > Philip II of Swabia =  Irene Angelica (great-great-granddaughter of
> > Alexius I Comnenus, Emperor of Byzantium)
> > Henry II of Brabant =  Marie of Swabia
> > Robert I of Artois =  Mechtilde of Brabant
> > Edmund 'Crouchback', Earl of Lancaster  =  Blanche of Artois
> > Henry, Earl of Lancaster =  Maud de Chaworth
> > Sir Richard FitzAlan, Earl of Arundel =  Eleanor Plantagenet
> > Sir John FitzAlan, Earl of Arundel =  Eleanor Maltravers
> > Sir Thomas Willoughby of Parham =  Joan FitzAlan
> > Sir Robert Willoughby =  Cicely Welles
> > Christopher Willoughby of Parham, Baron Willoughby d'Eresby =  Marjery
> > Jenny
> > William Eure, 1st Baron Eure =  Elizabeth Willoughby
> > Sir Ralph Eure, Warden of The Middle March =  Margery Bowes
> > Robert Lambton of Lambton (d. 1583) =  Frances Eure
> > John Lambton of Durham (d. 1628) =  Katherine Kirby
> > John Lambton of Durham (b. 1624) =  Margaret Hall
> > Sir Robert Eden (b. 1644 d. 17 May 1720) =  Margaret Lambton (b. 1651
> > d. 22 Jul 1730)
> > Sir John Eden (b. About 1680 d. 2 May 1728) =  Catherine Shafto (d. 2
> > Jul 1730)
> > Sir Robert Eden (b. About 1718 d. 25 Jun 1755) =  Mary Davison of
> > Beamish (d. 30 Jan 1794)
> > Thomas Eden (b. 1734 d. 1 May 1805) =  Mariana Jones (b. About 1750)
> > Arthur Eden (b. 9 Aug 1793 d. 1874) =  Frances Buncombe-Poulett-
> > Thomson (d. 25 Mar 1877)
> > Hugh Hammersley (d. 28 Sep 1882) =  Dulcibella Eden (d. 1903)
> > Walter Nassau Senior (b. 1850 d. 1933) =  Mabel Barbara Hammersley (b.
> > 1864 d. 1943)
> > Oliver Nassau Senior (b. 1901) =  Dorothy Gardner Smith (b. 31 May
> > 1904)
> > Denys Gordon Milne, CBE (b. 12 Jan 1926) =  Pamela Mary Senior (b. 23
> > Aug 1928)
> > Graham Nassau Gordon Senior-Milne (b. 29 Sep 1955)
>
> > I also have 406 documented descents from Kenneth MacAlpin. Here's one:
>
> > Kenneth I MacAlpin, King of Scots =  Not known
> > Constantine I, King of Scots =  Not known
> > Donald II, King of Scots =  Not known
> > Malcolm I, King of Scots =  Not known
> > Kenneth II, King of Scots =  Not known
> > Malcolm II, King of Scots =  Not known
> > Crinan 'The Thane', Mormaer of Atholl =  Bethoc
> > Duncan I, King of Scots =  Sybilla
> > Malcolm III 'Canmore', King of Scots =  St. Margaret
> > Henry I 'Beauclerc', King of England =  Matilda of Scotland
> > Geoffrey V of Anjou =  Matilda of Germany
> > Henry II 'Fitzempress', King of England =  Eleanor of Aquitaine,
> > Duchess of Aquitaine
> > Alphonso VIII, King of Castile =  Eleanor Plantagenet
> > Louis VIII, King of France =  Blanche of Castile
> > Robert I of Artois =  Mechtilde of Brabant
> > (See above for remainder)
>
> > Welcome to the family!
>
> Here's a pic taken from my uncle's yacht as we sailed past Kyeakin
> last year. You can see the castle in the background.
>
> http://www.peerage.org/P1008237.jpg- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

It can be quite a picturesque area, depending on the weather. My
favorite photograph of Dunakin has to be this one taken by the
photographer William Burns:

http://www.imagekind.com/Saucy-Marys-Castle_art?IMID=72971d70-eecf-4246-a596-f82602090b89

[Graham Milne]

On Feb 27, 11:51 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
wrote:
> On Feb 26, 11:59 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Feb 26, 5:26 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > wrote:
>
> > > On Feb 26, 9:34 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > wrote:
>
> > > > On Feb 26, 1:46 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > On Feb 26, 5:28 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > On Feb 26, 11:17 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > On Feb 26, 4:32 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > snip
>
> > > > > > > Is there any evidence that the Akins lived at Kyleakin?
>
> > > > > > Perhaps a bit of graffitti scratched on one of the rocks of
> > > > > > Dunakin.....there is our DNAhttp://www.worldfamilies.net/surnames/akins/results
> > > > > > which is catagorized as R1b1b2a1b5, known as the Northwest Irish modal
> > > > > > haplotype or Niall of the Nine Hostages group:
>
> > > > > > "As expected the majority of the Ulster families are the R1b1b2
> > > > > > haplogroup and its subclades. The group comes in circa 85% at present.
> > > > > > The dominate subclade in the group is the R1b1b2a1b5, which includes
> > > > > > the Northwest Irish modal, the R1b1b2a1b5b, or as some like to call it
> > > > > > the Niall of the Nine Hostages group. Most of the participants
> > > > > > classified into the R1b1b2 group have not yet done the necessary
> > > > > > subclade tests to determine if they also would be R1b1b2a1b5 group and
> > > > > > it is very likely that the majority would test positive to it.These
> > > > > > people are the descendants of Celtic tribal groups indigenous to
> > > > > > northern Ireland, Argyll, Aryshire, Wales, and other locations in
> > > > > > northern Britain."  -http://uhblog.ulsterheritage.com/2009/04/ulsters-genetic-roots-reveal...
>
> > > > > That doesn't establish a connection to Kyleakin, merely a general
> > > > > Celtic descent.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > > > I believe to get to the connection with the area of Kyle Akin you
> > > > would have to go back to the rather apochryphal ancient history of our
> > > > clan which states according to oral tradition that we are descended
> > > > from Eachin (Acainus), a son of Fingon (Findanus), son of Dungal
> > > > (Doungallus), son of Giric (Gregorius), son of Ailpein (Alpinus), son
> > > > of Eochaidh, etc....
>
> > > Can I take it from all this waffle that you have no proof whatsoever
> > > that the Akins family have any connection to Kyleakin?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > Proof is in the eye of the beholder when it comes to anything which
> > one does not personally experience first hand. At some point we all
> > have to resign ourselves to the fact that we can never have definate
> > proof of everything and that we must either accept what we are told is
> > the truth or reject it. I accept the fact that my clan has pedigree
> > which traces our origins back to Eachann mac Fingon mac Dungal mac
> > Gregor mac Alpin mac Eochaidh mac Aedh Find of the line of Fergus mac
> > Erc. I accept that there are legendary accounts that Dun Akin castle
> > and Kyle Akin derive their name from Hakon I, son of Harald Fairhair,
> > through the marriage of Hakon's daughter Maria to Fingon mac Dungal,
> > who are given as the early ancestors of the Clan Akins going back to
> > the Dark Ages, which would place my ancestors at Kyle Akin during a
> > time from which we have very little in the way of surviving records of
> > indisputable reliability.
>
> You seem to be claiming descent from Hakon. This would make us
> cousins. I have 67 documented descents from Olaf II (St. Olaf), who I
> think was Hakon's great-great-great-great-grandson (I didn't know of
> Hakon's connection to Kyleakin when I sailed there last summer - Wish
> I had!). Here's one:
>
> Olaf II, King of Norway =  Astrid III
> Ordulf, Duke of Saxony =  Wulfhilda of Norway
> Magnus, Duke of Saxony  =  Sophia of Hungary
> Henry I, Duke of Bavaria  =  Wulfhilda of Saxony
> Frederick II of Einaugige  =  Judith of Bavaria
> Frederick I 'Barbarossa'  =  Beatrix of Burgundy
> Philip II of Swabia =  Irene Angelica (great-great-granddaughter of
> Alexius I Comnenus, Emperor of Byzantium)
> Henry II of Brabant =  Marie of Swabia
> Robert I of Artois =  Mechtilde of Brabant
> Edmund 'Crouchback', Earl of Lancaster  =  Blanche of Artois
> Henry, Earl of Lancaster =  Maud de Chaworth
> Sir Richard FitzAlan, Earl of Arundel =  Eleanor Plantagenet
> Sir John FitzAlan, Earl of Arundel =  Eleanor Maltravers
> Sir Thomas Willoughby of Parham =  Joan FitzAlan
> Sir Robert Willoughby =  Cicely Welles
> Christopher Willoughby of Parham, Baron Willoughby d'Eresby =  Marjery
> Jenny
> William Eure, 1st Baron Eure =  Elizabeth Willoughby
> Sir Ralph Eure, Warden of The Middle March =  Margery Bowes
> Robert Lambton of Lambton (d. 1583) =  Frances Eure
> John Lambton of Durham (d. 1628) =  Katherine Kirby
> John Lambton of Durham (b. 1624) =  Margaret Hall
> Sir Robert Eden (b. 1644 d. 17 May 1720) =  Margaret Lambton (b. 1651
> d. 22 Jul 1730)
> Sir John Eden (b. About 1680 d. 2 May 1728) =  Catherine Shafto (d. 2
> Jul 1730)
> Sir Robert Eden (b. About 1718 d. 25 Jun 1755) =  Mary Davison of
> Beamish (d. 30 Jan 1794)
> Thomas Eden (b. 1734 d. 1 May 1805) =  Mariana Jones (b. About 1750)
> Arthur Eden (b. 9 Aug 1793 d. 1874) =  Frances Buncombe-Poulett-
> Thomson (d. 25 Mar 1877)
> Hugh Hammersley (d. 28 Sep 1882) =  Dulcibella Eden (d. 1903)
> Walter Nassau Senior (b. 1850 d. 1933) =  Mabel Barbara Hammersley (b.
> 1864 d. 1943)
> Oliver Nassau Senior (b. 1901) =  Dorothy Gardner Smith (b. 31 May
> 1904)
> Denys Gordon Milne, CBE (b. 12 Jan 1926) =  Pamela Mary Senior (b. 23
> Aug 1928)
> Graham Nassau Gordon Senior-Milne (b. 29 Sep 1955)
>
> I also have 406 documented descents from Kenneth MacAlpin. Here's one:
>
> Kenneth I MacAlpin, King of Scots =  Not known
> Constantine I, King of Scots =  Not known
> Donald II, King of Scots =  Not known
> Malcolm I, King of Scots =  Not known
> Kenneth II, King of Scots =  Not known
> Malcolm II, King of Scots =  Not known
> Crinan 'The Thane', Mormaer of Atholl =  Bethoc
> Duncan I, King of Scots =  Sybilla
> Malcolm III 'Canmore', King of Scots =  St. Margaret
> Henry I 'Beauclerc', King of England =  Matilda of Scotland
> Geoffrey V of Anjou =  Matilda of Germany
> Henry II 'Fitzempress', King of England =  Eleanor of Aquitaine,
> Duchess of Aquitaine
> Alphonso VIII, King of Castile =  Eleanor Plantagenet
> Louis VIII, King of France =  Blanche of Castile
> Robert I of Artois =  Mechtilde of Brabant
> (See above for remainder)
>
> Welcome to the family!

Interestingly, Irene Angelina (above), daughter of the Byzantine
Emperor Isaac II was described by Walther von der Vogelweide as "the
rose without a thorn, the dove without guile." So that's where the
expression comes from.

Taken from:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philip_of_Swabia

[Akins of that Ilk]

On Feb 27, 5:51 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
wrote:
> On Feb 26, 11:59 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Feb 26, 5:26 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > wrote:
>
> > > On Feb 26, 9:34 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > wrote:
>
> > > > On Feb 26, 1:46 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > On Feb 26, 5:28 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > On Feb 26, 11:17 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > On Feb 26, 4:32 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > snip
>
> > > > > > > Is there any evidence that the Akins lived at Kyleakin?
>
> > > > > > Perhaps a bit of graffitti scratched on one of the rocks of
> > > > > > Dunakin.....there is our DNAhttp://www.worldfamilies.net/surnames/akins/results
> > > > > > which is catagorized as R1b1b2a1b5, known as the Northwest Irish modal
> > > > > > haplotype or Niall of the Nine Hostages group:
>
> > > > > > "As expected the majority of the Ulster families are the R1b1b2
> > > > > > haplogroup and its subclades. The group comes in circa 85% at present.
> > > > > > The dominate subclade in the group is the R1b1b2a1b5, which includes
> > > > > > the Northwest Irish modal, the R1b1b2a1b5b, or as some like to call it
> > > > > > the Niall of the Nine Hostages group. Most of the participants
> > > > > > classified into the R1b1b2 group have not yet done the necessary
> > > > > > subclade tests to determine if they also would be R1b1b2a1b5 group and
> > > > > > it is very likely that the majority would test positive to it.These
> > > > > > people are the descendants of Celtic tribal groups indigenous to
> > > > > > northern Ireland, Argyll, Aryshire, Wales, and other locations in
> > > > > > northern Britain."  -http://uhblog.ulsterheritage.com/2009/04/ulsters-genetic-roots-reveal...
>
> > > > > That doesn't establish a connection to Kyleakin, merely a general
> > > > > Celtic descent.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > > > I believe to get to the connection with the area of Kyle Akin you
> > > > would have to go back to the rather apochryphal ancient history of our
> > > > clan which states according to oral tradition that we are descended
> > > > from Eachin (Acainus), a son of Fingon (Findanus), son of Dungal
> > > > (Doungallus), son of Giric (Gregorius), son of Ailpein (Alpinus), son
> > > > of Eochaidh, etc....
>
> > > Can I take it from all this waffle that you have no proof whatsoever
> > > that the Akins family have any connection to Kyleakin?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > Proof is in the eye of the beholder when it comes to anything which
> > one does not personally experience first hand. At some point we all
> > have to resign ourselves to the fact that we can never have definate
> > proof of everything and that we must either accept what we are told is
> > the truth or reject it. I accept the fact that my clan has pedigree
> > which traces our origins back to Eachann mac Fingon mac Dungal mac
> > Gregor mac Alpin mac Eochaidh mac Aedh Find of the line of Fergus mac
> > Erc. I accept that there are legendary accounts that Dun Akin castle
> > and Kyle Akin derive their name from Hakon I, son of Harald Fairhair,
> > through the marriage of Hakon's daughter Maria to Fingon mac Dungal,
> > who are given as the early ancestors of the Clan Akins going back to
> > the Dark Ages, which would place my ancestors at Kyle Akin during a
> > time from which we have very little in the way of surviving records of
> > indisputable reliability.
>
> You seem to be claiming descent from Hakon. This would make us
> cousins. I have 67 documented descents from Olaf II (St. Olaf), who I
> think was Hakon's great-great-great-great-grandson (I didn't know of
> Hakon's connection to Kyleakin when I sailed there last summer - Wish
> I had!). Here's one:
>
> Olaf II, King of Norway =  Astrid III
> Ordulf, Duke of Saxony =  Wulfhilda of Norway
> Magnus, Duke of Saxony  =  Sophia of Hungary
> Henry I, Duke of Bavaria  =  Wulfhilda of Saxony
> Frederick II of Einaugige  =  Judith of Bavaria
> Frederick I 'Barbarossa'  =  Beatrix of Burgundy
> Philip II of Swabia =  Irene Angelica (great-great-granddaughter of
> Alexius I Comnenus, Emperor of Byzantium)
> Henry II of Brabant =  Marie of Swabia
> Robert I of Artois =  Mechtilde of Brabant
> Edmund 'Crouchback', Earl of Lancaster  =  Blanche of Artois
> Henry, Earl of Lancaster =  Maud de Chaworth
> Sir Richard FitzAlan, Earl of Arundel =  Eleanor Plantagenet
> Sir John FitzAlan, Earl of Arundel =  Eleanor Maltravers
> Sir Thomas Willoughby of Parham =  Joan FitzAlan
> Sir Robert Willoughby =  Cicely Welles
> Christopher Willoughby of Parham, Baron Willoughby d'Eresby =  Marjery
> Jenny
> William Eure, 1st Baron Eure =  Elizabeth Willoughby
> Sir Ralph Eure, Warden of The Middle March =  Margery Bowes
> Robert Lambton of Lambton (d. 1583) =  Frances Eure
> John Lambton of Durham (d. 1628) =  Katherine Kirby
> John Lambton of Durham (b. 1624) =  Margaret Hall
> Sir Robert Eden (b. 1644 d. 17 May 1720) =  Margaret Lambton (b. 1651
> d. 22 Jul 1730)
> Sir John Eden (b. About 1680 d. 2 May 1728) =  Catherine Shafto (d. 2
> Jul 1730)
> Sir Robert Eden (b. About 1718 d. 25 Jun 1755) =  Mary Davison of
> Beamish (d. 30 Jan 1794)
> Thomas Eden (b. 1734 d. 1 May 1805) =  Mariana Jones (b. About 1750)
> Arthur Eden (b. 9 Aug 1793 d. 1874) =  Frances Buncombe-Poulett-
> Thomson (d. 25 Mar 1877)
> Hugh Hammersley (d. 28 Sep 1882) =  Dulcibella Eden (d. 1903)
> Walter Nassau Senior (b. 1850 d. 1933) =  Mabel Barbara Hammersley (b.
> 1864 d. 1943)
> Oliver Nassau Senior (b. 1901) =  Dorothy Gardner Smith (b. 31 May
> 1904)
> Denys Gordon Milne, CBE (b. 12 Jan 1926) =  Pamela Mary Senior (b. 23
> Aug 1928)
> Graham Nassau Gordon Senior-Milne (b. 29 Sep 1955)
>
> I also have 406 documented descents from Kenneth MacAlpin. Here's one:
>
> Kenneth I MacAlpin, King of Scots =  Not known
> Constantine I, King of Scots =  Not known
> Donald II, King of Scots =  Not known
> Malcolm I, King of Scots =  Not known
> Kenneth II, King of Scots =  Not known
> Malcolm II, King of Scots =  Not known
> Crinan 'The Thane', Mormaer of Atholl =  Bethoc
> Duncan I, King of Scots =  Sybilla
> Malcolm III 'Canmore', King of Scots =  St. Margaret
> Henry I 'Beauclerc', King of England =  Matilda of Scotland
> Geoffrey V of Anjou =  Matilda of Germany
> Henry II 'Fitzempress', King of England =  Eleanor of Aquitaine,
> Duchess of Aquitaine
> Alphonso VIII, King of Castile =  Eleanor Plantagenet
> Louis VIII, King of France =  Blanche of Castile
> Robert I of Artois =  Mechtilde of Brabant
> (See above for remainder)
>
> Welcome to the family!- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Here is the genealogy that I have tracing the lineage of Eachann or
Acainus:

Generation One:
Erc, King of Dal Riata in North Western Ireland. Died in 474.
Erc is said to be a son of Eochaid Munremar, King of Dal Riata; and is
said to have had several sons including Loarn and Fergus

Generation Two:
Fergus, King of Dalriada. Died circa 501
Fergus established the Irish kingdon of Dalraida in what is now
Argyle, Scotland. He is thought to have ruled for about three years in
succession to his brother Loarn.

Generation Three:
Domangart, King of Dalriada. Died circa 506
Married Feldelm Foltchain, said to be a daughter of Brion, son of
Eochaid Mugmedon. Brion was a half brother of Niall of the Nine
Hostages, a High King of Ireland in the 5th century.

Generation Four:
Gabhran, King of Dalriada. Died circa 559
Married to Ingenach or Lleian, a daughter of Brychan.

Generation Five:
Aedan, King of Dalriada. Died circa 608 after ruling for about 37
years.
Aedan is said to have been a cousin of St. Columba by whom he was
consecrated.

Generation Six:
Eochaid I Buide, King of Dalriada. Also Eochu Buide; Died circa 630
Eochaid was a younger son of Aedan, and succeeded as King of Dalriada
becuase all his older brothers had been killed.

Generation Seven:
Domnall Brecc, King of Dalriada. Died at the Battle of Strathcarron
circa 642

Generation Eight:
Domongart, who did not reign. Died (killed) circa 673

Generation Nine:
Eochaidh II, King of Dalriada. Died (killed) circa 697 after ruling
about three years.

Generation Ten:
Eochaidh III, King of Dalriada. Died circa 733 after ruling about
twelve years.

Generation Eleven:
Aedh Find “The White”, King of Dalriada. Died in 778 after ruling for
about 30 years.

Generation Twelve:
Eochaid “The Poisonous”, King of Dalriada. Ruled after 780.
Eochaid is said to have married to Unuistice, a Princess of the Picts.

Generation Thirteen:
Alpin of Kintyre, King of Dalriada
Died (killed fighting the Picts in Galloway) circa 837 after ruling
about three years. His son:

Generation Fourteen:
Gregor (Giric) Did not rule.
Giric was a younger brother of Kenneth (Cináed) MacAlpin, King of
Alba, who united the Scots and the Picts with the establishment of the
Kindom of Alba, which comprised Dalriada and the Kingdoms of the
Picts.

Generation Fifteen:
Doungallus (Dungal) *
Doungallus married the princess Spontana, daughter of the High King of
Ireland.

Generation Sixteen:
Findanus (Fingon)
Findanus married Maria, daughter of King Hakon I of Norway and
acquired Dunakin Castle at Kyle Akin on the Isle of Skye as a dowry.

Generation Seventeen:
Acainus (Eachann) Died (killed fighting the Danes in the Battle of
Luncarty) circa 980.
A younger son of Findanus, Acainus was the progenitor of the Clan
Akins.


The 108 Generations of Descent from Adam to Acainus
According to the Milesian Geneologies

Acainus (108), Fingon (107), Dungal (106), Gregor (105), Alpin 104),
Eochaid "the Poisonous" (103), Aedh Find (102), Eochaid III (101),
Eochaid II (100), Domongart (99), Domnall Brecc (98), Eochaid I Buide
(97), Aedan (96), Gabran (95), Eochaid (94), Domangart (93), Fergus
Mor (92), Erc (91), Eochaid Munremar (90), Niall Noigiallach (89),
Eochaidh Muigh Meadhoin (88), Muredach Tireach (87), Fiacha Srabhteine
(86), Cairbre Lifetree (85), Cormac Ulfhada Mac Art (84), Art-Ean-
Fhear (83), Conn Ceadcatha (82), Felim Rachtmar (81), Tuathal Teach
mar (80), Fiacha Fionn Ola (79), Feredach Fionn Feachtnach (78),
Crimthann Niadh-Nar (77), Lugaidh Sriabh-nDhearg (76), Breas-Nar-
Lothar (75), Eochaidh Feidhlioch (74), Fionn (73), Fionnloach (72),
Roighean Ruadh (71), Asaman Examined (70), Blathta Bamba (69), Labra
Luire (68), Enda Agneach (67), Aongus Turmeach Teamrach (66), Eochaidh
Altleathan (65), Olioll Casfiachalach (64), Conla Caomh (63), Iarn
Gleo-Fathach (62), Melg Molbhthach (61), Cobthach Caol-breagh (60),
Ugaine Mor (59), Eochaidh Buidhe (58), Duach Ladhrach (57), Fiachadh
Tolgrach (56), Muredach Bolgach (55), Simeon Breac (54), Aodh Glas
(53), Nuadhas Fionnfail (52), Galahad (51), Olioll Olchaoin (50),
Siorna Saoghalach (49), Dein (48), Rotheachta (47), Maon (46), Aongus
Ollmuchach (45), Fiachadh Lamhraein (44), Smiorgoill (43),
Eanbrotha(42), Tighearnmas (41), Falach (40), Eithriall (39), Irial
Faidh (38), Eremon (37), Milesius (36), Bile (35), Breoghan (34),
Brath (33), Deagh (32), Arcadh (31), Allah (30), Nuadhad (29), Nenuall
(28), Febric Glas (27), Agnan Fionn (26), Eber Glunfionn (25),
Lamhfionn (24), Agnan (23), Tait (22), Oghaman (21), Beoman (20), Eber
Scott (19), Sru (18), Esru (17), Gaedil Glas (16), Niul (15), Feinius
Farsaidh (14), Baath (13), Magog (12), Japhet (11), Noah (10), Lamech
(9), Methuselah (8), Enoch (7), Jared (6), Mahalaleel (5), Cainan (4),
Enos (3), Seth (2), Adam (1)

Although such legendary pedigrees must naturally be taken with a
rather large grain of salt, it does bear out the DNA findings which
show the Clan Akins to be descended from Niall Noigiallach.

[Graham Milne]

On Feb 27, 3:21 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
wrote:

snip

'Although such legendary pedigrees must naturally be taken with a
rather large grain of salt, it does bear out the DNA findings which
show the Clan Akins to be descended from Niall Noigiallach.'

Well, there you go. Case proved I think.

[Akins of that Ilk]

On Feb 27, 5:51 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
wrote:
> On Feb 26, 11:59 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Feb 26, 5:26 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > wrote:
>
> > > On Feb 26, 9:34 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > wrote:
>
> > > > On Feb 26, 1:46 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > On Feb 26, 5:28 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > On Feb 26, 11:17 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > On Feb 26, 4:32 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > snip
>
> > > > > > > Is there any evidence that the Akins lived at Kyleakin?
>
> > > > > > Perhaps a bit of graffitti scratched on one of the rocks of
> > > > > > Dunakin.....there is our DNAhttp://www.worldfamilies.net/surnames/akins/results
> > > > > > which is catagorized as R1b1b2a1b5, known as the Northwest Irish modal
> > > > > > haplotype or Niall of the Nine Hostages group:
>
> > > > > > "As expected the majority of the Ulster families are the R1b1b2
> > > > > > haplogroup and its subclades. The group comes in circa 85% at present.
> > > > > > The dominate subclade in the group is the R1b1b2a1b5, which includes
> > > > > > the Northwest Irish modal, the R1b1b2a1b5b, or as some like to call it
> > > > > > the Niall of the Nine Hostages group. Most of the participants
> > > > > > classified into the R1b1b2 group have not yet done the necessary
> > > > > > subclade tests to determine if they also would be R1b1b2a1b5 group and
> > > > > > it is very likely that the majority would test positive to it.These
> > > > > > people are the descendants of Celtic tribal groups indigenous to
> > > > > > northern Ireland, Argyll, Aryshire, Wales, and other locations in
> > > > > > northern Britain."  -http://uhblog.ulsterheritage.com/2009/04/ulsters-genetic-roots-reveal...
>
> > > > > That doesn't establish a connection to Kyleakin, merely a general
> > > > > Celtic descent.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > > > I believe to get to the connection with the area of Kyle Akin you
> > > > would have to go back to the rather apochryphal ancient history of our
> > > > clan which states according to oral tradition that we are descended
> > > > from Eachin (Acainus), a son of Fingon (Findanus), son of Dungal
> > > > (Doungallus), son of Giric (Gregorius), son of Ailpein (Alpinus), son
> > > > of Eochaidh, etc....
>
> > > Can I take it from all this waffle that you have no proof whatsoever
> > > that the Akins family have any connection to Kyleakin?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > Proof is in the eye of the beholder when it comes to anything which
> > one does not personally experience first hand. At some point we all
> > have to resign ourselves to the fact that we can never have definate
> > proof of everything and that we must either accept what we are told is
> > the truth or reject it. I accept the fact that my clan has pedigree
> > which traces our origins back to Eachann mac Fingon mac Dungal mac
> > Gregor mac Alpin mac Eochaidh mac Aedh Find of the line of Fergus mac
> > Erc. I accept that there are legendary accounts that Dun Akin castle
> > and Kyle Akin derive their name from Hakon I, son of Harald Fairhair,
> > through the marriage of Hakon's daughter Maria to Fingon mac Dungal,
> > who are given as the early ancestors of the Clan Akins going back to
> > the Dark Ages, which would place my ancestors at Kyle Akin during a
> > time from which we have very little in the way of surviving records of
> > indisputable reliability.
>
> You seem to be claiming descent from Hakon. This would make us
> cousins. I have 67 documented descents from Olaf II (St. Olaf), who I
> think was Hakon's great-great-great-great-grandson (I didn't know of
> Hakon's connection to Kyleakin when I sailed there last summer - Wish
> I had!). Here's one:
>
> Olaf II, King of Norway =  Astrid III
> Ordulf, Duke of Saxony =  Wulfhilda of Norway
> Magnus, Duke of Saxony  =  Sophia of Hungary
> Henry I, Duke of Bavaria  =  Wulfhilda of Saxony
> Frederick II of Einaugige  =  Judith of Bavaria
> Frederick I 'Barbarossa'  =  Beatrix of Burgundy
> Philip II of Swabia =  Irene Angelica (great-great-granddaughter of
> Alexius I Comnenus, Emperor of Byzantium)
> Henry II of Brabant =  Marie of Swabia
> Robert I of Artois =  Mechtilde of Brabant
> Edmund 'Crouchback', Earl of Lancaster  =  Blanche of Artois
> Henry, Earl of Lancaster =  Maud de Chaworth
> Sir Richard FitzAlan, Earl of Arundel =  Eleanor Plantagenet
> Sir John FitzAlan, Earl of Arundel =  Eleanor Maltravers
> Sir Thomas Willoughby of Parham =  Joan FitzAlan
> Sir Robert Willoughby =  Cicely Welles
> Christopher Willoughby of Parham, Baron Willoughby d'Eresby =  Marjery
> Jenny
> William Eure, 1st Baron Eure =  Elizabeth Willoughby
> Sir Ralph Eure, Warden of The Middle March =  Margery Bowes
> Robert Lambton of Lambton (d. 1583) =  Frances Eure
> John Lambton of Durham (d. 1628) =  Katherine Kirby
> John Lambton of Durham (b. 1624) =  Margaret Hall
> Sir Robert Eden (b. 1644 d. 17 May 1720) =  Margaret Lambton (b. 1651
> d. 22 Jul 1730)
> Sir John Eden (b. About 1680 d. 2 May 1728) =  Catherine Shafto (d. 2
> Jul 1730)
> Sir Robert Eden (b. About 1718 d. 25 Jun 1755) =  Mary Davison of
> Beamish (d. 30 Jan 1794)
> Thomas Eden (b. 1734 d. 1 May 1805) =  Mariana Jones (b. About 1750)
> Arthur Eden (b. 9 Aug 1793 d. 1874) =  Frances Buncombe-Poulett-
> Thomson (d. 25 Mar 1877)
> Hugh Hammersley (d. 28 Sep 1882) =  Dulcibella Eden (d. 1903)
> Walter Nassau Senior (b. 1850 d. 1933) =  Mabel Barbara Hammersley (b.
> 1864 d. 1943)
> Oliver Nassau Senior (b. 1901) =  Dorothy Gardner Smith (b. 31 May
> 1904)
> Denys Gordon Milne, CBE (b. 12 Jan 1926) =  Pamela Mary Senior (b. 23
> Aug 1928)
> Graham Nassau Gordon Senior-Milne (b. 29 Sep 1955)
>
> I also have 406 documented descents from Kenneth MacAlpin. Here's one:
>
> Kenneth I MacAlpin, King of Scots =  Not known
> Constantine I, King of Scots =  Not known
> Donald II, King of Scots =  Not known
> Malcolm I, King of Scots =  Not known
> Kenneth II, King of Scots =  Not known
> Malcolm II, King of Scots =  Not known
> Crinan 'The Thane', Mormaer of Atholl =  Bethoc
> Duncan I, King of Scots =  Sybilla
> Malcolm III 'Canmore', King of Scots =  St. Margaret
> Henry I 'Beauclerc', King of England =  Matilda of Scotland
> Geoffrey V of Anjou =  Matilda of Germany
> Henry II 'Fitzempress', King of England =  Eleanor of Aquitaine,
> Duchess of Aquitaine
> Alphonso VIII, King of Castile =  Eleanor Plantagenet
> Louis VIII, King of France =  Blanche of Castile
> Robert I of Artois =  Mechtilde of Brabant
> (See above for remainder)
>
> Welcome to the family!- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Here is the line of descent I have for Eachann or Acainus:

Generation One:
Erc, King of Dal Riata in North Western Ireland. Died in 474.
Erc is said to be a son of Eochaid Munremar, King of Dal Riata; and is
said to have had several sons including Loarn and Fergus

Generation Two:
Fergus, King of Dalriada. Died circa 501
Fergus established the Irish kingdon of Dalraida in what is now
Argyle, Scotland. He is thought to have ruled for about three years in
succession to his brother Loarn.

Generation Three:
Domangart, King of Dalriada. Died circa 506
Married Feldelm Foltchain, said to be a daughter of Brion, son of
Eochaid Mugmedon. Brion was a half brother of Niall of the Nine
Hostages, a High King of Ireland in the 5th century.

Generation Four:
Gabhran, King of Dalriada. Died circa 559
Married to Ingenach or Lleian, a daughter of Brychan.

Generation Five:
Aedan, King of Dalriada. Died circa 608 after ruling for about 37
years.
Aedan is said to have been a cousin of St. Columba by whom he was
consecrated.

Generation Six:
Eochaid I Buide, King of Dalriada. Also Eochu Buide; Died circa 630
Eochaid was a younger son of Aedan, and succeeded as King of Dalriada
becuase all his older brothers had been killed.

Generation Seven:
Domnall Brecc, King of Dalriada. Died at the Battle of Strathcarron
circa 642

Generation Eight:
Domongart, who did not reign. Died (killed) circa 673

Generation Nine:
Eochaidh II, King of Dalriada. Died (killed) circa 697 after ruling
about three years.

Generation Ten:
Eochaidh III, King of Dalriada. Died circa 733 after ruling about
twelve years.

Generation Eleven:
Aedh Find “The White”, King of Dalriada. Died in 778 after ruling for
about 30 years.

Generation Twelve:
Eochaid “The Poisonous”, King of Dalriada. Ruled after 780.
Eochaid is said to have married to Unuistice, a Princess of the Picts.

Generation Thirteen:
Alpin of Kintyre, King of Dalriada
Died (killed fighting the Picts in Galloway) circa 837 after ruling
about three years. His son:

Generation Fourteen:
Gregor (Giric) Did not rule.
Giric was a younger brother of Kenneth (Cináed) MacAlpin, King of
Alba, who united the Scots and the Picts with the establishment of the
Kindom of Alba, which comprised Dalriada and the Kingdoms of the
Picts.

Generation Fifteen:
Doungallus (Dungal) *
Doungallus married the princess Spontana, daughter of the High King of
Ireland.

Generation Sixteen:
Findanus (Fingon)
Findanus married Maria, daughter of King Hakon I of Norway and
acquired Dunakin Castle at Kyle Akin on the Isle of Skye as a dowry.

Generation Seventeen:
Acainus (Eachann) Died (killed fighting the Danes in the Battle of
Luncarty) circa 980.
A younger son of Findanus, Acainus was the progenitor of the Clan
Akins.


The 108 Generations of Descent from Adam to Acainus
According to the Milesian Geneologies

Acainus (108), Fingon (107), Dungal (106), Gregor (105), Alpin 104),
Eochaid "the Poisonous" (103), Aedh Find (102), Eochaid III (101),
Eochaid II (100), Domongart (99), Domnall Brecc (98), Eochaid I Buide
(97), Aedan (96), Gabran (95), Eochaid (94), Domangart (93), Fergus
Mor (92), Erc (91), Eochaid Munremar (90), Niall Noigiallach (89),
Eochaidh Muigh Meadhoin (88), Muredach Tireach (87), Fiacha Srabhteine
(86), Cairbre Lifetree (85), Cormac Ulfhada Mac Art (84), Art-Ean-
Fhear (83), Conn Ceadcatha (82), Felim Rachtmar (81), Tuathal Teach
mar (80), Fiacha Fionn Ola (79), Feredach Fionn Feachtnach (78),
Crimthann Niadh-Nar (77), Lugaidh Sriabh-nDhearg (76), Breas-Nar-
Lothar (75), Eochaidh Feidhlioch (74), Fionn (73), Fionnloach (72),
Roighean Ruadh (71), Asaman Examined (70), Blathta Bamba (69), Labra
Luire (68), Enda Agneach (67), Aongus Turmeach Teamrach (66), Eochaidh
Altleathan (65), Olioll Casfiachalach (64), Conla Caomh (63), Iarn
Gleo-Fathach (62), Melg Molbhthach (61), Cobthach Caol-breagh (60),
Ugaine Mor (59), Eochaidh Buidhe (58), Duach Ladhrach (57), Fiachadh
Tolgrach (56), Muredach Bolgach (55), Simeon Breac (54), Aodh Glas
(53), Nuadhas Fionnfail (52), Galahad (51), Olioll Olchaoin (50),
Siorna Saoghalach (49), Dein (48), Rotheachta (47), Maon (46), Aongus
Ollmuchach (45), Fiachadh Lamhraein (44), Smiorgoill (43),
Eanbrotha(42), Tighearnmas (41), Falach (40), Eithriall (39), Irial
Faidh (38), Eremon (37), Milesius (36), Bile (35), Breoghan (34),
Brath (33), Deagh (32), Arcadh (31), Allah (30), Nuadhad (29), Nenuall
(28), Febric Glas (27), Agnan Fionn (26), Eber Glunfionn (25),
Lamhfionn (24), Agnan (23), Tait (22), Oghaman (21), Beoman (20), Eber
Scott (19), Sru (18), Esru (17), Gaedil Glas (16), Niul (15), Feinius
Farsaidh (14), Baath (13), Magog (12), Japhet (11), Noah (10), Lamech
(9), Methuselah (8), Enoch (7), Jared (6), Mahalaleel (5), Cainan (4),
Enos (3), Seth (2), Adam (1)

Naturally any pedigree going back this far must be taken with a rather
large grain of salt, but it does bear out the DNA findings that show
the Clan Akins to be patrilineally descended from Niall Noigiallach.

[Graham Milne]

On Feb 27, 4:20 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
wrote:
> On Feb 27, 6:16 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Feb 27, 11:51 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > wrote:
>
> > > On Feb 26, 11:59 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > wrote:
>
> > > > On Feb 26, 5:26 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > On Feb 26, 9:34 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > On Feb 26, 1:46 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > On Feb 26, 5:28 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > On Feb 26, 11:17 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > On Feb 26, 4:32 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > snip
>
> > > > > > > > > Is there any evidence that the Akins lived at Kyleakin?
>
> > > > > > > > Perhaps a bit of graffitti scratched on one of the rocks of
> > > > > > > > Dunakin.....there is our DNAhttp://www.worldfamilies.net/surnames/akins/results
> > > > > > > > which is catagorized as R1b1b2a1b5, known as the Northwest Irish modal
> > > > > > > > haplotype or Niall of the Nine Hostages group:
>
> > > > > > > > "As expected the majority of the Ulster families are the R1b1b2
> > > > > > > > haplogroup and its subclades. The group comes in circa 85% at present.
> > > > > > > > The dominate subclade in the group is the R1b1b2a1b5, which includes
> > > > > > > > the Northwest Irish modal, the R1b1b2a1b5b, or as some like to call it
> > > > > > > > the Niall of the Nine Hostages group. Most of the participants
> > > > > > > > classified into the R1b1b2 group have not yet done the necessary
> > > > > > > > subclade tests to determine if they also would be R1b1b2a1b5 group and
> > > > > > > > it is very likely that the majority would test positive to it.These
> > > > > > > > people are the descendants of Celtic tribal groups indigenous to
> > > > > > > > northern Ireland, Argyll, Aryshire, Wales, and other locations in
> > > > > > > > northern Britain."  -http://uhblog.ulsterheritage.com/2009/04/ulsters-genetic-roots-reveal...
>
> > > > > > > That doesn't establish a connection to Kyleakin, merely a general
> > > > > > > Celtic descent.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > > > > > I believe to get to the connection with the area of Kyle Akin you
> > > > > > would have to go back to the rather apochryphal ancient history of our
> > > > > > clan which states according to oral tradition that we are descended
> > > > > > from Eachin (Acainus), a son of Fingon (Findanus), son of Dungal
> > > > > > (Doungallus), son of Giric (Gregorius), son of Ailpein (Alpinus), son
> > > > > > of Eochaidh, etc....
>
> > > > > Can I take it from all this waffle that you have no proof whatsoever
> > > > > that the Akins family have any connection to Kyleakin?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > > > Proof is in the eye of the beholder when it comes to anything which
> > > > one does not personally experience first hand. At some point we all
> > > > have to resign ourselves to the fact that we can never have definate
> > > > proof of everything and that we must either accept what we are told is
> > > > the truth or reject it. I accept the fact that my clan has pedigree
> > > > which traces our origins back to Eachann mac Fingon mac Dungal mac
> > > > Gregor mac Alpin mac Eochaidh mac Aedh Find of the line of Fergus mac
> > > > Erc. I accept that there are legendary accounts that Dun Akin castle
> > > > and Kyle Akin derive their name from Hakon I, son of Harald Fairhair,
> > > > through the marriage of Hakon's daughter Maria to Fingon mac Dungal,
> > > > who are given as the early ancestors of the Clan Akins going back to
> > > > the Dark Ages, which would place my ancestors at Kyle Akin during a
> > > > time from which we have very little in the way of surviving records of
> > > > indisputable reliability.
>
> > > You seem to be claiming descent from Hakon. This would make us
> > > cousins. I have 67 documented descents from Olaf II (St. Olaf), who I
> > > think was Hakon's great-great-great-great-grandson (I didn't know of
> > > Hakon's connection to Kyleakin when I sailed there last summer - Wish
> > > I had!). Here's one:
>
> > > Olaf II, King of Norway =  Astrid III
> > > Ordulf, Duke of Saxony =  Wulfhilda of Norway
> > > Magnus, Duke of Saxony  =  Sophia of Hungary
> > > Henry I, Duke of Bavaria  =  Wulfhilda of Saxony
> > > Frederick II of Einaugige  =  Judith of Bavaria
> > > Frederick I 'Barbarossa'  =  Beatrix of Burgundy
> > > Philip II of Swabia =  Irene Angelica (great-great-granddaughter of
> > > Alexius I Comnenus, Emperor of Byzantium)
> > > Henry II of Brabant =  Marie of Swabia
> > > Robert I of Artois =  Mechtilde of Brabant
> > > Edmund 'Crouchback', Earl of Lancaster  =  Blanche of Artois
> > > Henry, Earl of Lancaster =  Maud de Chaworth
> > > Sir Richard FitzAlan, Earl of Arundel =  Eleanor Plantagenet
> > > Sir John FitzAlan, Earl of Arundel =  Eleanor Maltravers
> > > Sir Thomas Willoughby of Parham =  Joan FitzAlan
> > > Sir Robert Willoughby =  Cicely Welles
> > > Christopher Willoughby of Parham, Baron Willoughby d'Eresby =  Marjery
> > > Jenny
> > > William Eure, 1st Baron Eure =  Elizabeth Willoughby
> > > Sir Ralph Eure, Warden of The Middle March =  Margery Bowes
> > > Robert Lambton of Lambton (d. 1583) =  Frances Eure
> > > John Lambton of Durham (d. 1628) =  Katherine Kirby
> > > John Lambton of Durham (b. 1624) =  Margaret Hall
> > > Sir Robert Eden (b. 1644 d. 17 May 1720) =  Margaret Lambton (b. 1651
> > > d. 22 Jul 1730)
> > > Sir John Eden (b. About 1680 d. 2 May 1728) =  Catherine Shafto (d. 2
> > > Jul 1730)
> > > Sir Robert Eden (b. About 1718 d. 25 Jun 1755) =  Mary Davison of
> > > Beamish (d. 30 Jan 1794)
> > > Thomas Eden (b. 1734 d. 1 May 1805) =  Mariana Jones (b. About 1750)
> > > Arthur Eden (b. 9 Aug 1793 d. 1874) =  Frances Buncombe-Poulett-
> > > Thomson (d. 25 Mar 1877)
> > > Hugh Hammersley (d. 28 Sep 1882) =  Dulcibella Eden (d. 1903)
> > > Walter Nassau Senior (b. 1850 d. 1933) =  Mabel Barbara Hammersley (b.
> > > 1864 d. 1943)
> > > Oliver Nassau Senior (b. 1901) =  Dorothy Gardner Smith (b. 31 May
> > > 1904)
> > > Denys Gordon Milne, CBE (b. 12 Jan 1926) =  Pamela Mary Senior (b. 23
> > > Aug 1928)
> > > Graham Nassau Gordon Senior-Milne (b. 29 Sep 1955)
>
> > > I also have 406 documented descents from Kenneth MacAlpin. Here's one:
>
> > > Kenneth I MacAlpin, King of Scots =  Not known
> > > Constantine I, King of Scots =  Not known
> > > Donald II, King of Scots =  Not known
> > > Malcolm I, King of Scots =  Not known
> > > Kenneth II, King of Scots =  Not known
> > > Malcolm II, King of Scots =  Not known
> > > Crinan 'The Thane', Mormaer of Atholl =  Bethoc
> > > Duncan I, King of Scots =  Sybilla
> > > Malcolm III 'Canmore', King of Scots =  St. Margaret
> > > Henry I 'Beauclerc', King of England =  Matilda of Scotland
> > > Geoffrey V of Anjou =  Matilda of Germany
> > > Henry II 'Fitzempress', King of England =  Eleanor of Aquitaine,
> > > Duchess of Aquitaine
> > > Alphonso VIII, King of Castile =  Eleanor Plantagenet
> > > Louis VIII, King of France =  Blanche of Castile
> > > Robert I of Artois =  Mechtilde of Brabant
> > > (See above for remainder)
>
> > > Welcome to the family!
>
> > PS I think you will find these lines amongst quite a number of this
> > groups members.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> Undoubtedly so, I have found that several of my families share common
> ancestors through one line or another. Among the families who came to
> America as colonists in the 1600's and 1700's that I am descended from
> are the following:
>
> Akins
> Alexander
> Anderson
> Atkins
> Ball
> Barnett
> Beckham
> Black
> Broadnax
> Butler
> Cole
> Courington
> Davis
> Edwards
> Evans
> Ferebee
> Ferris
> Forbes
> Forrester
> Foster
> Furlow
> Giles
> Goad
> Goode
> Hagan
> Harding
> Harris
> Haynie
> Henderson
> Henson
> Hollis
> Howard
> Howell
> Howle
> Hurley
> Jones
> Joslin
> Keeton
> Kemp
> Kincheloe
> Knowles
> Lane
> Lang
> Lewis
> Long
> Loving
> Lucy
> Mackerness
> McCorkle
> McKennie
> Mercer
> Minter
> Morgan
> Morris
> Mosby
> Mote
> Parsons
> Phillips
> Putman
> Quatermas
> Randolph
> Rice
> Rutledge
> Scott
> Smith
> Spears
> Stacks
> Staggs
> Stephens
> Stribling
> Sumner
> Taliaferro
> Taylor
> Thomas
> Townley
> Traylor
> Walker
> Watson
> Williams
> Woodson
> Woodward

You must surely have traced a royal descent from one of these
families. I note you include the Forbes family. I am related to the
Forbes family of Boston (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forbes_family -
search for Sarah Forbes on this page) via the Hughes. They are an old
Scottish family. The still own Naschon Island (http://en.wikipedia.org/
wiki/Naushon_Island) where my niece went to stay last summer. It is a
private island with no cars I think - at least until recently. My
cousin, Octavia Hughes, remembers going to dinner on the island in a
coach and horses. There is a picture of the main house at:

http://www.williamrdavis.net/landscape3.html

John Forbes Kerry, the Presidential candidate, is related to these
Forbes's.

[Akins of that Ilk]

On Feb 27, 10:55 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
wrote:
> On Feb 27, 4:20 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Feb 27, 6:16 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > wrote:
>
> > > On Feb 27, 11:51 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > wrote:
>
> > > > On Feb 26, 11:59 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > On Feb 26, 5:26 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > On Feb 26, 9:34 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > On Feb 26, 1:46 pm, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > On Feb 26, 5:28 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > On Feb 26, 11:17 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
> > > > > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > > On Feb 26, 4:32 pm, Akins of that Ilk <***@yahoo.com>
> > > > > > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > > snip
>
> > > > > > > > > > Is there any evidence that the Akins lived at Kyleakin?
>
> > > > > > > > > Perhaps a bit of graffitti scratched on one of the rocks of
> > > > > > > > > Dunakin.....there is our DNAhttp://www.worldfamilies.net/surnames/akins/results
> > > > > > > > > which is catagorized as R1b1b2a1b5, known as the Northwest Irish modal
> > > > > > > > > haplotype or Niall of the Nine Hostages group:
>
> > > > > > > > > "As expected the majority of the Ulster families are the R1b1b2
> > > > > > > > > haplogroup and its subclades. The group comes in circa 85% at present.
> > > > > > > > > The dominate subclade in the group is the R1b1b2a1b5, which includes
> > > > > > > > > the Northwest Irish modal, the R1b1b2a1b5b, or as some like to call it
> > > > > > > > > the Niall of the Nine Hostages group. Most of the participants
> > > > > > > > > classified into the R1b1b2 group have not yet done the necessary
> > > > > > > > > subclade tests to determine if they also would be R1b1b2a1b5 group and
> > > > > > > > > it is very likely that the majority would test positive to it.These
> > > > > > > > > people are the descendants of Celtic tribal groups indigenous to
> > > > > > > > > northern Ireland, Argyll, Aryshire, Wales, and other locations in
> > > > > > > > > northern Britain."  -http://uhblog.ulsterheritage.com/2009/04/ulsters-genetic-roots-reveal...
>
> > > > > > > > That doesn't establish a connection to Kyleakin, merely a general
> > > > > > > > Celtic descent.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > > > > > > I believe to get to the connection with the area of Kyle Akin you
> > > > > > > would have to go back to the rather apochryphal ancient history of our
> > > > > > > clan which states according to oral tradition that we are descended
> > > > > > > from Eachin (Acainus), a son of Fingon (Findanus), son of Dungal
> > > > > > > (Doungallus), son of Giric (Gregorius), son of Ailpein (Alpinus), son
> > > > > > > of Eochaidh, etc....
>
> > > > > > Can I take it from all this waffle that you have no proof whatsoever
> > > > > > that the Akins family have any connection to Kyleakin?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > > > > Proof is in the eye of the beholder when it comes to anything which
> > > > > one does not personally experience first hand. At some point we all
> > > > > have to resign ourselves to the fact that we can never have definate
> > > > > proof of everything and that we must either accept what we are told is
> > > > > the truth or reject it. I accept the fact that my clan has pedigree
> > > > > which traces our origins back to Eachann mac Fingon mac Dungal mac
> > > > > Gregor mac Alpin mac Eochaidh mac Aedh Find of the line of Fergus mac
> > > > > Erc. I accept that there are legendary accounts that Dun Akin castle
> > > > > and Kyle Akin derive their name from Hakon I, son of Harald Fairhair,
> > > > > through the marriage of Hakon's daughter Maria to Fingon mac Dungal,
> > > > > who are given as the early ancestors of the Clan Akins going back to
> > > > > the Dark Ages, which would place my ancestors at Kyle Akin during a
> > > > > time from which we have very little in the way of surviving records of
> > > > > indisputable reliability.
>
> > > > You seem to be claiming descent from Hakon. This would make us
> > > > cousins. I have 67 documented descents from Olaf II (St. Olaf), who I
> > > > think was Hakon's great-great-great-great-grandson (I didn't know of
> > > > Hakon's connection to Kyleakin when I sailed there last summer - Wish
> > > > I had!). Here's one:
>
> > > > Olaf II, King of Norway =  Astrid III
> > > > Ordulf, Duke of Saxony =  Wulfhilda of Norway
> > > > Magnus, Duke of Saxony  =  Sophia of Hungary
> > > > Henry I, Duke of Bavaria  =  Wulfhilda of Saxony
> > > > Frederick II of Einaugige  =  Judith of Bavaria
> > > > Frederick I 'Barbarossa'  =  Beatrix of Burgundy
> > > > Philip II of Swabia =  Irene Angelica (great-great-granddaughter of
> > > > Alexius I Comnenus, Emperor of Byzantium)
> > > > Henry II of Brabant =  Marie of Swabia
> > > > Robert I of Artois =  Mechtilde of Brabant
> > > > Edmund 'Crouchback', Earl of Lancaster  =  Blanche of Artois
> > > > Henry, Earl of Lancaster =  Maud de Chaworth
> > > > Sir Richard FitzAlan, Earl of Arundel =  Eleanor Plantagenet
> > > > Sir John FitzAlan, Earl of Arundel =  Eleanor Maltravers
> > > > Sir Thomas Willoughby of Parham =  Joan FitzAlan
> > > > Sir Robert Willoughby =  Cicely Welles
> > > > Christopher Willoughby of Parham, Baron Willoughby d'Eresby =  Marjery
> > > > Jenny
> > > > William Eure, 1st Baron Eure =  Elizabeth Willoughby
> > > > Sir Ralph Eure, Warden of The Middle March =  Margery Bowes
> > > > Robert Lambton of Lambton (d. 1583) =  Frances Eure
> > > > John Lambton of Durham (d. 1628) =  Katherine Kirby
> > > > John Lambton of Durham (b. 1624) =  Margaret Hall
> > > > Sir Robert Eden (b. 1644 d. 17 May 1720) =  Margaret Lambton (b. 1651
> > > > d. 22 Jul 1730)
> > > > Sir John Eden (b. About 1680 d. 2 May 1728) =  Catherine Shafto (d. 2
> > > > Jul 1730)
> > > > Sir Robert Eden (b. About 1718 d. 25 Jun 1755) =  Mary Davison of
> > > > Beamish (d. 30 Jan 1794)
> > > > Thomas Eden (b. 1734 d. 1 May 1805) =  Mariana Jones (b. About 1750)
> > > > Arthur Eden (b. 9 Aug 1793 d. 1874) =  Frances Buncombe-Poulett-
> > > > Thomson (d. 25 Mar 1877)
> > > > Hugh Hammersley (d. 28 Sep 1882) =  Dulcibella Eden (d. 1903)
> > > > Walter Nassau Senior (b. 1850 d. 1933) =  Mabel Barbara Hammersley (b.
> > > > 1864 d. 1943)
> > > > Oliver Nassau Senior (b. 1901) =  Dorothy Gardner Smith (b. 31 May
> > > > 1904)
> > > > Denys Gordon Milne, CBE (b. 12 Jan 1926) =  Pamela Mary Senior (b. 23
> > > > Aug 1928)
> > > > Graham Nassau Gordon Senior-Milne (b. 29 Sep 1955)
>
> > > > I also have 406 documented descents from Kenneth MacAlpin. Here's one:
>
> > > > Kenneth I MacAlpin, King of Scots =  Not known
> > > > Constantine I, King of Scots =  Not known
> > > > Donald II, King of Scots =  Not known
> > > > Malcolm I, King of Scots =  Not known
> > > > Kenneth II, King of Scots =  Not known
> > > > Malcolm II, King of Scots =  Not known
> > > > Crinan 'The Thane', Mormaer of Atholl =  Bethoc
> > > > Duncan I, King of Scots =  Sybilla
> > > > Malcolm III 'Canmore', King of Scots =  St. Margaret
> > > > Henry I 'Beauclerc', King of England =  Matilda of Scotland
> > > > Geoffrey V of Anjou =  Matilda of Germany
> > > > Henry II 'Fitzempress', King of England =  Eleanor of Aquitaine,
> > > > Duchess of Aquitaine
> > > > Alphonso VIII, King of Castile =  Eleanor Plantagenet
> > > > Louis VIII, King of France =  Blanche of Castile
> > > > Robert I of Artois =  Mechtilde of Brabant
> > > > (See above for remainder)
>
> > > > Welcome to the family!
>
> > > PS I think you will find these lines amongst quite a number of this
> > > groups members.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > Undoubtedly so, I have found that several of my families share common
> > ancestors through one line or another. Among the families who came to
> > America as colonists in the 1600's and 1700's that I am descended from
> > are the following:
>
> > Akins
> > Alexander
> > Anderson
> > Atkins
> > Ball
> > Barnett
> > Beckham
> > Black
> > Broadnax
> > Butler
> > Cole
> > Courington
> > Davis
> > Edwards
> > Evans
> > Ferebee
> > Ferris
> > Forbes
> > Forrester
> > Foster
> > Furlow
> > Giles
> > Goad
> > Goode
> > Hagan
> > Harding
> > Harris
> > Haynie
> > Henderson
> > Henson
> > Hollis
> > Howard
> > Howell
> > Howle
> > Hurley
> > Jones
> > Joslin
> > Keeton
> > Kemp
> > Kincheloe
> > Knowles
> > Lane
> > Lang
> > Lewis
> > Long
> > Loving
> > Lucy
> > Mackerness
> > McCorkle
> > McKennie
> > Mercer
> > Minter
> > Morgan
> > Morris
> > Mosby
> > Mote
> > Parsons
> > Phillips
> > Putman
> > Quatermas
> > Randolph
> > Rice
> > Rutledge
> > Scott
> > Smith
> > Spears
> > Stacks
> > Staggs
> > Stephens
> > Stribling
> > Sumner
> > Taliaferro
> > Taylor
> > Thomas
> > Townley
> > Traylor
> > Walker
> > Watson
> > Williams
> > Woodson
> > Woodward
>
> You must surely have traced a royal descent from one of these
> families. I note you include the Forbes family. I am related to the
> Forbes family of Boston (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forbes_family-
> search for Sarah Forbes on this page) via the Hughes. They are an old
> Scottish family. The still own Naschon Island (http://en.wikipedia.org/
> wiki/Naushon_Island) where my niece went to stay last summer. It is a
> private island with no cars I think - at least until recently. My
> cousin, Octavia Hughes, remembers going to dinner on the island in a
> coach and horses. There is a picture of the main house at:
>
> http://www.williamrdavis.net/landscape3.html
>
> John Forbes Kerry, the Presidential candidate, is related to these
> Forbes's.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

My Forbes family went to Pennsylvania and then moved South to the
Carolinas before the Revolutionary War, settling in the Mecklenburg
Co., NC / York Co., SC vicinity. See: http://home.centurytel.net/tnfraziers/data/forbes/forbes.html
A photograph of tombstone of my 6th great grandmother, Elizabeth
Forbes, who is buried at Ebenezer Presbyterian Church in Rock Hill,
South Carolina, can be see here:
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll212/my_family_photographs/family%20monuments/ElizabethForbes.jpg
and the reverse side with epitaph here:
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll212/my_family_photographs/family%20monuments/ElizabethForbes2.jpg

[Akins of that Ilk]

On Feb 27, 10:55 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
wrote:

> You must surely have traced a royal descent from one of these
> families. I note you include the Forbes family. I am related to the
> Forbes family of Boston (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forbes_family-
> search for Sarah Forbes on this page) via the Hughes. They are an old
> Scottish family. The still own Naschon Island (http://en.wikipedia.org/
> wiki/Naushon_Island) where my niece went to stay last summer. It is a
> private island with no cars I think - at least until recently. My
> cousin, Octavia Hughes, remembers going to dinner on the island in a
> coach and horses. There is a picture of the main house at:
>
> http://www.williamrdavis.net/landscape3.html
>
> John Forbes Kerry, the Presidential candidate, is related to these
> Forbes's.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Yes, I have quite a few lines that trace back to Royal personages such
as King David I of Scoitland, Malcolm Ceanmore, William the Conquorer,
Charlemagne, etc.

My Forbes family went to Pennsylvania and then moved South to the
Carolinas before the Revolutionary War, settling in the Mecklenburg
Co., NC / York Co., SC vicinity. See: http://home.centurytel.net/tnfraziers/data/forbes/forbes.html
A photograph of tombstone of my 6th great grandmother, Elizabeth
Forbes, who is buried at Ebenezer Presbyterian Church in Rock Hill,
South Carolina, can be see here:
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll212/my_family_photographs/family...
and the reverse side with epitaph here:
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll212/my_family_photographs/family...

[Akins of that Ilk]

On Feb 27, 10:55 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
wrote:
>
> You must surely have traced a royal descent from one of these
> families. I note you include the Forbes family. I am related to the
> Forbes family of Boston (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forbes_family-
> search for Sarah Forbes on this page) via the Hughes. They are an old
> Scottish family. The still own Naschon Island (http://en.wikipedia.org/
> wiki/Naushon_Island) where my niece went to stay last summer. It is a
> private island with no cars I think - at least until recently. My
> cousin, Octavia Hughes, remembers going to dinner on the island in a
> coach and horses. There is a picture of the main house at:
>
> http://www.williamrdavis.net/landscape3.html
>
> John Forbes Kerry, the Presidential candidate, is related to these
> Forbes's.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Yes, I have quite a few lines that trace back to Royal personages
such
as King David I of Scoitland, Malcolm Ceanmore, William the
Conquorer,
Charlemagne, etc.

My Forbes family went to Pennsylvania and then moved South to the
Carolinas before the Revolutionary War, settling in the Mecklenburg
Co., NC / York Co., SC vicinity. See: http://home.centurytel.net/tnfraziers/data/forbes/forbes.html
A photograph of tombstone of my 6th great grandmother, Elizabeth
Forbes, who is buried at Ebenezer Presbyterian Church in Rock Hill,
South Carolina, can be see here:
Yes, I have quite a few lines that trace back to Royal personages
such
as King David I of Scoitland, Malcolm Ceanmore, William the
Conquorer,
Charlemagne, etc.

My Forbes family went to Pennsylvania and then moved South to the
Carolinas before the Revolutionary War, settling in the Mecklenburg
Co., NC / York Co., SC vicinity. See: http://home.centurytel.net/tnfraziers/data/forbes/forbes.html
A photograph of tombstone of my 6th great grandmother, Elizabeth
Forbes, who is buried at Ebenezer Presbyterian Church in Rock Hill,
South Carolina, can be see here:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/***@N04/5482183459/
and the reverse side with epitaph here:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/***@N04/5482778680/

[Akins of that Ilk]

On Feb 27, 10:55 am, Graham Milne <***@btinternet.com>
wrote:
> You must surely have traced a royal descent from one of these
> families. I note you include the Forbes family. I am related to the
> Forbes family of Boston (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forbes_family-
> search for Sarah Forbes on this page) via the Hughes. They are an old
> Scottish family. The still own Naschon Island (http://en.wikipedia.org/
> wiki/Naushon_Island) where my niece went to stay last summer. It is a
> private island with no cars I think - at least until recently. My
> cousin, Octavia Hughes, remembers going to dinner on the island in a
> coach and horses. There is a picture of the main house at:
>
> http://www.williamrdavis.net/landscape3.html
>
> John Forbes Kerry, the Presidential candidate, is related to these
> Forbes's.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Yes, I have quite a few other lines that trace back to royal
personages
such as King David I of Scotland, Malcolm Ceanmore, William the
Conquorer, Charlemagne, etc.


My Forbes family went to Pennsylvania and then moved South to the
Carolinas before the Revolutionary War, settling in the Mecklenburg
Co., NC / York Co., SC vicinity. See: http://home.centurytel.net/tnfraziers/data/forbes/forbes.html
A photograph of tombstone of my 6th great grandmother, Elizabeth
Forbes, who is buried at Ebenezer Presbyterian Church in Rock Hill,
South Carolina, can be see here:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/***@N04/5482183459/
and the reverse side with epitaph here:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/***@N04/5482778680/

[c***@gmail.com]

On Friday, February 25, 2011 12:49:50 AM UTC-5, Akins of that Ilk wrote:
> According to official records, the father of Malcolm Ian Sinclair,
> 20th Earl of Caithness, is supposed to be the late Brigadier James
> Roderick Sinclair, 19th Earl of Caithness; however new evidence raises
> a question of the present Earl's paternity. See:
> http://i1038.photobucket.com/albums/a470/the_scotsman1745/Clan%20Chiefs/moleofcaithness.jpg
> Certainly the physical resemblence is striking to say the lewast.

Physical appearances are totally unimportant. So please forgive that the first thing that popped into my head when seeing a picture of you was a fat, self-satisfied beaver. What is more important is how people behave. You certainly don't set an example. And how low a person can stoop is quite remarkable. To say the leWast.